Ill be back...

[WaR-ped]

Im not really waiting patiently for the next messaih of video cards, and my friend is considering to build himself a new computer and has considered matrox. I own a G400MAX that I might sell him. But what do without a video card? Well, seeing as how its been made public that matrox next card will not be a gaming card at all(meaning that the performance i see now is probably fairly close to their next card), im thinking I will get a temporary card till this magic gaming card from matrox comes out. I figured atleast another year and a half before its announced.

so what do i get? Im thinking about the RADEON 64MB DDR VIVO. $180 seems reasonable since i payed $220 for my present card.

Is this a reasonable plan from all y'all? How is ATI with Win2k drivers?

------------------
.:880Mhz Deathtrap:.

• Lite-On FS020 enclosure w/4 120mm Panaflos and soon a 172mm Nidec
• MSI 694D Pro w/ BIOS 1.6
• 2x800E cC0 Pentium 3 w/ 2xGolden Orb
• SyncMAX(NEC) PC166 VCM SDRAM 4x128mb w/ CAS = 1
• Matrox G400MAX 176/219
• And other non-important stuff like hard drives and a dvd drive
• Pineapples

[Liquid Snake]

Well, AFAIK, donkeys could write better Win2K drivers than ATI could Benchmarks have shown the Radeon to be SIGNIFICANTLY slower in Win2K.

[arbymo]

sorry if this is off-topic, but ur having ur memory at CAS 1 ? how's that ? is that a new standard yet ?

[Barbarella]

Cas=1 is right.

He use NEC's Virtual Memory Channel, Not classic SDRAM.

[This message has been edited by Barbarella (edited 25 April 2001).]

[Darin]

I have a Radeon AIW, which I'm running on 98SE. Haven't tried it on Win2K (moved my G400 into my Win2k box, don't even have it loaded on my 98 machine). Obviously, I can't give you any first hand experience using the Radeon on Win2k, but I do spend a fair amount of time at www.rage3d.com, and it seems that the Win2k users have reported some pretty decent improvements in those drivers. If you are looking at this as a gaming card, there are still a few games that have a few problems. Particularly those that use a certain type of fog. The only game I ever play is Q3, which has no problems, and runs very well on my system. I also occasionally play Kyodai Majhong (sp?), which is also great on my system (for a DirectX reference). You'd be best served by placing a post at www.rage3d.com with your system specs & the games you play, & see if anyone closer to your situation than I replies.

FWIW, I've been fairly happy with the Radeon. At this point, however, I could NOT recommened the AIW version considering the price premium, as the extra features it has seem to be the most problematic of the Radeon series. In fact, if you are considering this as a stop gap situation, and don't need the VIVO features, I would consider getting one of the cheap 32MB LE versions for less than half the price (last I saw, they could be found for less than $80). I think they are hands down the best value out there right now. I've seen one person suggest that the LE versions have lower quality components, and might not have the excellent 2D quality the other models have, but I've not seen anyone else echo that. The regular (non-LE) 32MB models aren't that much more, and still much less than the 64MB model, if the LE makes you nervous.

With today's games, you won't see much advantage of 64MB, especially considering ATI's bandwidth reducing techniques, and the 32MB models can usually be overclocked to around the 64MB speeds (give or take). IMHO, the Radeon's 2D is in the same league as Matrox: definately better than the Nvidia based products. The biggest variable in the Radeon products continues to be ATI's support. They do appear to be making an attempt to improve their reputation in this area: there have beeen many (official AND unofficial) driver releases in the past several months, BUT, the differences between them is minimal to my eyes. It does appear, however, that the Win2K crowd is reporting much more visible improvements in the driver area.

Overall, a good card, and with the current options, I would definately buy again (just not the AIW version). As can be seen in any online forum, there are issues with the Radeon that tend to get blown a little out of proportion by those that experience it. The Radeon works very well for most people in most applications, but there are a few issues that are very real, you just need to spend a little bit of research time making sure they wouldn't apply to you.

Hope this helps.

[Darin]

P.S.
As I said, ATI SEEMS to be TRYING to get better at driver support, but their efforts have not yet convinced me that they able/willing to continue making the kind of improvements that I would like to see. Until they have a better success rate for a longer period of time, I would look at the cards as they stand today, with the belief that any issues that may be there will be there for the life of the card. If ATI fixes them, then great, but if not, it's better to accept that up front.

[DukeP]

Its speedier, its flashy, its MUCH cheaper.. Go for the Kyro 2 64mb.

Read it and weep. Poor matrox. Right in their designated target area.

http://www.tomshardware.com/graphic/01q2/010425/index.html

Ah well..
~~DukeP~~

[Novdid]

Read Anand´s review:

http://www.anandtech.com/showdoc.html?i=1435

It even kicks the Ultra in some benches.
I already love this card before I´ve seen it. Well I have already preordered it 4 weeks ago. My doubts in big M has grown quite a bit lately (G450).

My only concern is Kyro II 2d quality.

[Darin]

The KII does look very promising. I'll be holding my final opinion until final drivers are released, to see if they can resolve some of the issues it has. Assuming they can (and I expect they will), , they keep the price/performance ratio high, AND the 2D quality is high, the successor to the KII could be a major contender for my next upgrade. The unknown 2d quality & comparatively low ramdac speed do give me some concerns. 2D qualtiy is THE factor that totally eliminated Nvidia from the list when I was looking to upgrade from the G400.

[Maggi]

http://forums.murc.ws/ubb/Forum3/HTML/003760.html

I put some benchmark charts about the Kyro II and according links into that thread ...

[Kruzin]

Relocated to General Hardware/Software forum

[WaR-ped]

What about the Elsa Gloria II or III?

I dont want to get a budget crap card, but i dont want to spend a fortune either. I do have a Voodoo3 2000 lying around, so getting a budget card seems to be a waste of time. but then again, I checked out rage3d and there seems to be oodles of problems with the radeon in win2k..

oh matrox, why cant you release a damn video card? Why must a purcahse crap?