CBR 5500, you might be able to live with!

[wkulecz]

Especially if you've actually been watching VCD and SVCDs.

Appears that the MSP6.5 VBR doesn't create valid streams.

On the Apex, the glitch event frequency is reduced by half or more, the audio dropouts, if not gone, are down to where I can't say it wasn't dropped in the SVHS I started with (meaning sound it there, just a temporary reduction in volume). The most noticable video mosaic breakups seem to be in the same spots for both the Apex and Zenith player, its possible a higher bitrate would make these unnoticable. On the Zenith I'd rate the mosaics as certainly no worse than what one often sees on MTV2 digital cable channel (assuminmg its the feed and not my local Time-Warner Cable system, or you may not know what I mean).

There are quite a few folks on rec.video.digital claiming to be producing "perfect" disks. I've called a couple of them on it, offering to send a blank of their preferred brand and a self addressed return mailer if they will burn a disk with at least 1 hr of video on it. Viewing less than 20 minutes proves nothing!

I'll still likely return the thing unless Sonic or Pioneer comes thru on Monday with some fixes that let their bundled software actually author a disk. The Prassi PrimoDVD 2.0 is working 100% as I expected and is no harder to use than Nero so if I could author images with compliant streams I'd be keeping it.

I've one blank left, I'm gonna give one more try with Sonic DVDit!/MyDVD, and while that's going on I'll encode a 8000CBR with MSP6.5 to try if MyDVD fails again (never gets far enough to try a test burn).

I think the claims of two hour capacity is only for people who could be happy watching VHS SLP to SLP dubs.

--wally.

[Dr Mordrid]

Are you adding this command to your ulead32.ini file;

[VIODRIVER]
SeqHeader=1

It's required to make the DVD compliant streams, but isn't for use with VCD/SVCD.

Dr. Mordrid

[wkulecz]

The SeqHeader=1 line is not added in a fresh install of MSP6.5
if its needed, its a bug in the installer. Actually whatever it does should be being set when the NTSC-DVD template is chosen, conversely for VCD or SVCD templates the proper state should be set when template is selected. Personally I'd rather not see any options available that produce non-standards conforming streams. If people want to play, enabling the "Advance" button with warning that changes will produce non-compliant streams should be a decent compromise.

Seeing you suggest this eariler, I made this change for my second disk. Made no real difference.

I think there is clearly something wrong with MSP6.5 NTSC-DVD mpeg2 encoding and/or authoring.

The A03 MyDVD bundled software is unusable. If it doesn't crash, its transcoding from DV is so slow to be useless -- a 15 min DV file has been running overnight and it still only ~70% finished (if I believe the status bar) on a PIII-500 with 512MB RAM using its default encoder setings. Projects less than 20-30 min will lead to many false positive claims of success. the package states: "Software Requirements Pentium 300Mhz processor, or higher". What are these guys smoking?

I think we are a lot farther from being able to make our own DVDs for standalone players than the advertisements would lead one to believe.

If you've got at least 1hr of known compliant DVD image, I've a cable modem and DSL available to download it -- I'll waste my last blank on it and want to know the encoder/authoring software used. If the software costs more than the burner, I rest my case.

--wally.

[BrianP]

a different encoder?

Just wondering... have you tried a different encoder? I don't use/have MSPro 6.5 and would probably be using TMPGEnc. I realize TMPGEnc doesn't encode the timeline for you, but perhaps just for testing purposes if you have a long bit of raw footage you could see if that would do VBR without problems.

[wkulecz]

I thought about TMPGEnc 2.0 but I've no idea if it's producing compliant streams either, I doubt the author has even a tiny fraction of the resources of Ulead, so how could he verify it or not?

The bundled MyDVD software has some kind of transcoder, but its too slow to be usable -- so slow that I can't even say if it work at all. Remember less than 20-30 minutes will tell you nothing!

That was the idea behind trying the NeoDVD demo -- but its rigged to not do more than 15 minutes -- see a pattern here?

--wally.

[Dr Mordrid]

1. the DVD Plugin doesn't put seqheader=1 into ulead32.ini because 98.5% of users are currently using VCD and SVCD, NOT DVD! If it were put in by the installer those would be broken and piss off even more people.

2. TMPGEnc produces more compliant streams than just about any commercial encoder I've seen. Just because it's free doesn't prevent a LOT of pros from using it or its quality from being excellent.

Dr. Mordrid

[wkulecz]

Doc,

you're beginnig to sound like a Ulead appologist.

Are you suggesting their programmers aren't clever enough to set the internal state defined by SeqHeader variable to its proper value when the DVD (or VCD or SVCD) template is chosen? Or is the code so poorly written that its an either-or proposition that is set when the program loaded and hence needs to be "rebooted" to change it? Editing a file in the windows system directory to change it is a real nice touch! -- perhaps I can learn something from these masters. I'm sure our ISO9000 system could also benefit from the quality control procedures they used to verify the DVD plugin before offering it for sale.

In either case, let's drop the pretense that MSP is somehow a "professional" level product.

TMPGEnc only encodes, not authors, so if the problem is Ulead's authoring I still won't learn anything. If TMPGenc is "more compliant", but still not "compliant enough", I've still gotten nothing other than $10 poorer :-)

--wally.


MyDVD, 16+ hrs, maybe 80% on the status bar transcoding ~15 minute DV clip. MSP6.5 did the whole 1hr 8min in <8hrs on the same machine the previous night!

Looks like its time to try and revive SVHS now that a decent playback deck can be had for <$150. Seems to be the only way for better than VHS output for the time being, although many of you might be happy with 5500CBR (or higher) just don't think you can meet the expectations of folks renting DVD's for much more than maybe a 30-40 min project on a $10 disk. OTOH if you've actually been watching VCD and SVCDs (instead of simply making them) you'll likely be thrilled with the CBR disks.


I'm not frustrated or in pain -- technology is my life, I enjoy figuring things out. The software industry needs a trip to the woodshed for a whoopin' but good! I resent the time I waste sending this crap back, but otherwise its been fun! I ain't done yet. I'll buy and return (if necessay) a Pioneer DVD player at Best Buy and report back later, Circuit City won't sell me another right now :-)

I've one person take me up on rec.video.desktop so far, I await his Email reply on where to send the blanks. I'll mail 'em off when I return the A03 package :-(

[BrianP]

Are the people who claim to have "perfect discs" using MyDVD? Or something else? (Please don't say Macs! )

[wkulecz]

Those who's said PC haven't specifically said what software they've authored with. But nobody seems to be defending MyDVD.

Most have said Macs from what I've seen up to now.

--wally.

[Dr Mordrid]

Wally,

What's being an appolgist? The use of a sequence header is required by DVD and not recommended by VCD or SVCD.

That they decided to support the most commonly used configuration with the installer makes sense to me.

Dr. Mordrid

[wkulecz]

Exit program, edit \winnt\ulead32.ini, restart program to make a DVD followed by a VCD or SVCD (or vice-versa) is something only a mother could love. Software companies that think the above is acceptable design need to be drummed out of business.

Oh by the way, did you miss my response where I said SeqHeader=1 didn't make the glitches go away on on VBR5500?

My CBR5500 was with the SeqHeader line removed completely from the ini file to match what is setup by the virgin install file. The little paper insert that passes for documentation of the DVD plugin makes no mention of adding SeqHeader to the ini file. The Ulead website only mentions MSP6.0 and DVD plugin as needing SeqHeader=1 for DVD. One might hope a few problems were fixed between release for MSP6 and bundling with MSP6.5 for the plugin.

My ex-wife had a motto -- Expect Nothing.
seems to apply to the MSP6.5 update & A03.

I guess it'd be easy to be happy with the A03 & MSP6.5 if your expectations are low enough.

Perhaps I'm onto something and should apply for a software patent on automatically enabling/disabling a dependent variable based on a prior variable's selection value.

--wally.

PS
MyDVD finished transcoding a 15min DV file and its not been an entire 24 hours! I was at Best Buy while this momentous occasion occured so I don't exactly how long it took, should be able try a bur in a couple more days -- gee I'm just so impatient.