Capturing Video

[Joxx]

Hello,

My interest in video is capturing and playing, rather than editing. I have marvel G400-TV and a few questions.

Is my marvel capturing at 704*540(something) or is it 352*288(something) interpolated to 704/540? I think that the captured video from antenna, is less than normal TV quality from antenna.

Is the Video captured in the TV-tuner or in some other part of the marvel? Has RT2000 higher capure quality than my marvel?

Is a macrovision crack for VT 1.54 coming?

Thanks.. /Joxx

[fluggo99]

Your Marvel captures full 704*576 video when instructed to; it does no interpolation during capture. During playback to your monitor, it interpolates the video when possible to make it look all spiffy. (Even 352*288 video will be blown up to look full size on playback-- don't ask me why) You can look at the actual data that was captured by trying to play two videos at once.

I don't exactly know what part of the Marvel does the capturing... or that necessarily matters... As far as picture quality from an antenna, remember that a TV is an analog device, and has a lot easier time working with weird signals than a digital device like your Marvel.

Yes, the RT2000 does capture higher quality; 16 more pixels in the horizontal, for the standard DV/D1 size of 740*576. It also captures in MPEG-2 and DV, both reputed to be excellent compression schemes. If you're talking about TV-tuner quality, I'm guessing the RT2000 doesn't have one (it's a video editing solution, not a general-purpose graphics card like the Marvel).

[Joxx]

Michel Carleer,

that's bloody marvelous! Unfortunately the PCTV has no TV-out, do you know of any other capture board with equal quality and TV-out?

I must admit that the marvel quality is much worse than TV quality, you can notice it specially when looking closely to text or small hockey result numbers. If there was a board with equal or even better quality than TV and TV-out that would be absoloutly wonderful.

I saw that you also get a remote control with the PCTV, how great! Thats just what we want, isn't is!

Please give me information about a good capture board with TV-out.

Thanks.. /joxx

[Michel Carleer]

Joxx,
I don't know if I understand what you mean by TV-out. Do you need an output to record back to a VCR what you just captured and edited? Or do you need a video output from the tuner to be able to capture with a higher quality capture card?
OK, to clarify, here is my setup:
I look at TV programs with the PCTV pro (which has an IR remote). I do not capture with the PCTV card, because it does not have a hardware compressor so that it is limited to capturing at 352x288 at 25 fps. Capturing at any higher resolution ends up with dropped frames. But the PCTV has an internal video out (and audio out) which outputs the selected TV-tuner channel. This input I feed to my Pinnacle DV500 digitization card. This last card has DV and analog inputs and outputs and I am using it to capture (at 720x576x25, DV format), edit and then send back the result to either my DV camcorder or a VHS video recorder. Or I compress the result in MPEG1 format which is a format that every Win PC's can play through the Windows Media Player.
Of course, the G400 Marvel card also has an analog TV out which could also be used for VHS back-recording. This would be the cheapest solution if you want to record back what you captured, and provided you are happy with a picture resolution of 352x288 (which by the way is the standard PAL MPEG1 resolution): a PCTV pro to capture, and use the TV-out of the Marvel to record back to a VHS recorder. If you want higher picture resolution, a hardware assisted compressing board is absolutely necessary. That's why I bought the Marvel, but unfortunately the picture quality... so I made the big plunge and just bought a DV500, which is also justified by my digital camcorder.
Michka

[Meek]

I suppose you all know that during capture with PC-VCR the Marvel/RR-G does not de-interlace the picture and has a far better quality.

If there just was a registry entry or something to make it not do that...

M.

[Joxx]

I guess I'd like a soloution with very high quality tuning/digitizing from antenna, high resolution capturing with a hardware codec (mjpeg or mpeg-2/4) to make vcd/divx-cd.

Then I'd also want to be able to output DVD/my homemade cd's to VCR/TV so that I can watch it in my living room. For the latter the DVD-max option is perfect!

Is there any board which like the marvel is made for video capturing and DVD watching on TV, but with better quality (at least equal to TV, 704*576 res.)? I am highly interested in such a soloution.

/joxx

[Michel Carleer]

Meek,
You are absolutely right for the Win98 drivers. From my own experience it seems there is no more a difference between what is shown real-time and what is captured, with the W2k drivers: Now both are low quality. I already told Haig that in my view I should be the one choosing to deinterlace (or blurr) or not, and not the driver written by Matrox.

Joxx,
I only know of one other capture card that has a TV-out and DVD playback: the ATI All-in-Wonder. But it only captures at low res like the PCTV. And I tried one some 5 months ago and had a lot of problems with the buggiest drivers I have ever seen (some versions even refused to install, some others would install but Windows would crash during boot). Plus the tuner was highly sensitive to all and every electromagnetic noise generated by the PC itself, so that some channels could simply not be watched at all. This one went back to the dealer and was exchanged for the ... Marvel!
But there are other capture cards out there from companies like Creative or even Asus (the motherboard maker)and others. Someone has any info on these cards? I mean not only the specs but also real life use results and comments.

[Joxx]

neither asus or creative hace any hardwarecodec cards...

I think that one can demand capture quality that is at least on par from a company like Matrox, that claims that they offer compromise-less soloutions... It's a shame..

/joxx

[Michel Carleer]

fluggo99,
I am sorry to say that I totally agree with Joxx. The picture quality of the Marvel (or the RR-G for that matter) is by far below par. Not only during capture but also during TV real time viewing. I do not agree that the picture quality has to be less than with a regular TV set because of the digital nature of the grabbed picture. Simply look at the picture presented by a Hauppauge WinTV or a Pinnacle PCTV and see for yourself the huge quality difference. In fact with the latter two cards, the picture quality is far better (higher resolution) than on a regular TV set.
The problem with the Marvel comes, I think (but am not sure), from some sort of deinterlacing process which completely blurrs the picture. It is so much blurred that I reverted back to my old PCTV pro and use the Marvel as if it were just a plain G400.
Michka

[Michel Carleer]

Joxx,
Have you considered a Pinnacle PCTV + DC10+ combo? It should cost about the same as a Marvel.
There is at least one drawback: there is no w2k or wnt driver for the DC10+.
Another possibility would be the PCTV + DC30+. But this is about three times as expensive.
Both the DC10+ and the DC30+ have a TV-out and record in MJPEG.
Now of course, as you said, Matrox should provide good quality pictures. If you can convince them to allow the end-user to choose the quality... I tried, but without success or even an answer. I believe it is just a fixed setting imposed by the driver.
Michka


[This message has been edited by Michel Carleer (edited 08 June 2000).]

[fluggo99]

I know you guys left this way back there, but the picture quality has two sides to it:

1. Watching TV/videos on your monitor

I agree. Stinks.

2. Editing video/playback to TV

Rocks. The captured video is nice quality.