Matrox announces RT.X10...realtime for $599

[goldstein]

So the bottom line on VIA chipsets it seems is that older SIS sucks; if buying a new MB make sure it is the most recent VIA incarnation with BIG bandwidth +555 at least...well, at least that is how my simple head processess it

ps...do you think this m/b would be ok for the system I thinking of building for vid capture using rt2500:


GA-7VRXP

http://www.giga-byte.com/products/7vrxp.htm

[KRSESQ]

Tough call. The Gigabyte GA-7ZXR is on the Matrox-approved list. If they're closely enough related it could work.

One thing I noticed was that the approved VIA-chipset boards have Award or AMI BIOS. The IWill KV200 on the unapproved list has a Phoenix BIOS. Don't know if it's this or other architecture differences that make the difference.

Doc?

Kevin

[Dr Mordrid]

I have used the most recent VIA incarnation with the 533 v-link. N0 CHANGE in how it handles high-bandwidth cards.

VIA chipsets are the sole occupants of the INCOMPATABLE list for both of the RT.X cards with the following advisory;

"VIA chipsets for Intel and AMD processors are not recommended for use with a Matrox RT.X system because they do not work well when performing realtime DV output, or when editing or playing back Timelines that contain complex effects, such as particle and blur effects. These chipsets have all demonstrated a PCI bandwidth limitation when reading from host memory (RAM). This is seen when heavy PCI bandwidth (such as for video, graphics, and effects) is required by several PCI devices at the same time."

BIOS brand/version does not matter. It's a fundamental flaw in VIA's design that has not been adressed since the MVP-4 days and persists to this day in the KT series.

Stick with the SiS chipped boards as they do more with their pipeline other than just make it wider. There are also differences in how DMA is handled to each individual PCI slot as well and they matter a lot.

Interesting data from LostCircuits.com's review of the K7S5A (SiS735) and how its 533 mb/s interconnect affects PCI & drive performance;

"The need for additional bandwidth is becoming rather obvious. Where about one year ago, UATA/66 drives were already capable of saturating the 133 MB/sec data transfer limit of the PCI interface, storage technology has taken another giant leap towards 133 MB/sec burst transfers. This means that even the (standard) 266 MB/sec interconnect can be jammed effectively with file transfers from one drive to another. Here is where the SIS chipset really shines...... "

I agree....

Also: if a mainboard uses the new SiS 963 southbridge you get 1066 mb/s pipes instead of VIA's 533 mb/s

Dr. Mordrid

[Elie]

I totally agree with Doc!

Guys and Gals,

As a word of advice, DO NOT BUY VIA BASED MOTHERBOARDS!

I know they are cheap and all, but with VIA no matter how new, is bandwidth limiting, which means cards like NLE's soundcards, SCSI, RAID etc. will not perform like it will on SIS, AMD or Intel chipsets.

I had my doubts too, and had to see it myself before making any assumptions.

Regards,
Elie

[goldstein]

You know all this chat about chipsets makes think that I do no really know what "chipsets" do? I understand a processor (AMD Intel) is the "brain" of the computer and handles complex computations and that the the PCI slots/RAID/HD interface is where data enters the computer...but what exactly is the function of a chipset? Are they physical chips that sit in the motherboard with VIA and SIS stamped on? What do they do?

Also, why don't the CPU makers make their own chipsets, wouldn't they know best what their products do? How does the performance of these consumer based systems compare to pro-systems like SUN microsystems servers, have the AMD Intel crowd caught up.

Many questions I know, but it would make me more smart if I knew what people were talking about Metaphors are also a good thing when explaining to me lol.

thanks

[KRSESQ]

Simply put, the chipset acts as Traffic Cop for the system, directing data from the PCI bus and periferal devices to RAM, to the hard drive, to the CPU, as needed. Some chipsets are more efficient at this than others.

A close examination of your system's motherboard can tell you what kind of chipset it has. Look for one or two medium-large-ish chips stamped with the name VIA, Intel, SIS, etc. and an identifying number (some newer chipsets have heatsinks covering them. Don't try to remove it unless you know what you're doing!) .

And yes, both Intel and AMD make their own chipsets for their processors, and one would think that those would be best. Sometimes they are, and sometimes they aren't. It depends on what the intended use of the system is. The best advise is search the web, compare MBs, and research the different chipsets to see what they're best for. Most importantly, browse forums like this one to see what kind of experience real world users have.

An aside: Doc, I'm going to try that ECS motherboard you suggested earlier. Now somebody go to EBay and buy my old Fasttrak66 controller so I can afford it!

Kevin

[goldstein]

Much appreciated Kevin, so I suppose VIA is the "bad cop" for matrox video purposes

[Dr Mordrid]

You got it, but it goes deeper than that. SiS also provides a more efficient way of handling data from each individual PCI slot. Look it as their take on AMD's HyperTransport or Intels HubLink, but with a few twists. VIA tries to keep up with their VLink, but with the fundamental problems in their chipsets they are hobbled from the get-go.

In the SiS chipsets each PCI slot gets its own set of DMA busses (busmaster, address, input data and output data...all of which support pipeline and split transaction) , which means that high bandwidth devices don't have to compete for the same pipe. This means that multiple high-bandwidth devices can be used at once efficiently. The IDE I/O also gets a boost as do a few other bits.

SiS started this with a 533 mb/s total bandwidth in the SiS 791/792 MuTOIL southbridges. With the SiS 693 southbridge this gets upped to 1066 mb/s. God knows what they'll do for the Opteron

This kind of feature set will become even more important as SerialATA, HDTV editing cards and other very high bandwidth hardware come to market.

Dr. Mordrid

[KRSESQ]

Knew I could count on you to fill in the details!

Kevin