Video editing package required - which one

[DarrenD]

I am currently trialling VideoStudio 6 but have a few concerns about it and wanted you knowledgable lot to help me towards the right package.

I have a Marvel G400-TV (UK PAL) and capture my Hi-8 camcorder tape (1 hour long) using Matrox MJPEG in Win98se using AVI_IO. I am really trying to get this done under Win2K SP3 but I guess I would need to buy PICVIDEO codec.

Having captured the AVI files I intend (dual-booting) moving over to Win2K to do the editing. I tried using VirtualDub to play the AVI file and simply note start/stop times throughout the captured file, then go back and cut out the rubbish bits, saving each start/stop bit as a separate file (or combine some together as a single if they were recorded on the same day - 1 hour of kids over several weeks). Each file would then be loaded into TMPGenc and converted to DVD format. I would then use VCDEasy (or something else) to put the clips into a DVD with nice little chapters for each day.

That's the theory...

When I try playing in VirtualDub it seems my Athlon 900 is not up to the job of playing it back quickly enough and the file stutters. This really messes up the "experience" of watching the capture to find the start/stop points. What is strange is that VideoStudio 6 seems to play it back fine without stutters and so I can get the start/stop times. Having VS6 means I can do fancy transitions (I know the "more is less" rule) that I would not get using VirtualDub (just simple end of one AVI straight into the next one). What bugs me about VS6 is that people say its encoder is not very good so I would like to frameserve from it into TMPGenc which people say is the best.

Can you helpful people tell me how I can improve my playback on VirtualDub or how to frameserve from VS6 or are there other programs I could use?

Money is an issue, hence the initial freeware/cheap software route (Matrox MJPEG, AVI_IO [paid for], VirtualDub, TMPGEnc [MPEG-1, but I have to pay a little for MPEG-2], VCDEasy [not got this far yet]). However, I appreciate some things are better paid for (hence I use AVI_IO for capture instead of VirtualDub - always seemed to drop frames).

After playing with VS6 for a while (a long night!) I have come to the conclusion that start/stop editing takes many hours for a 1 hour tape (I have to be there) and rendering will take even longer (although it can be done when I am not there). Does this seem an accurate conclusion?

Thanks for any advice and also for reading such a long post.

[Dr Mordrid]

Effective editing most always takes 2-3 times the project length, and that's for relatively plain projects without a lot of high end effects. It was even longer in the old days of using tape instead of hard drives

The theory of what you're doing is correct, especially using PICVideo as a substitute for Matrox MJPeg. A PicVideo quality setting of 19 best approximates Matrox's quality level.

Dr. Mordrid

[DarrenD]

Thanks Dr Mordrid.

Can you suggest a program? With your RT.X100 I guess you are using Premiere. That's too expensive for me.

[wkulecz]

IMHO the best bang for the buck in editing is MSP6.5 You can get the "lite" version bundled with an ADS PyroDV 1394 card for ~$80.
You can ugrade to the full version later if you want.


Video Studio lacks a real timeline and overlay tracks, I find it much harder to use than MSP. Typical of these "guided workflow" programs that become pretty useless as soon as you want to do anything differently.

--wally.

[Dr Mordrid]

MSPro is certainly my choice for anyone not using a realtime card because of its ease of use and efficient use of system resources. That Premiere has to be used with my RT.X100 is inconvenient, but the card smooths over some of its larger problems and provides a very neat luma/chroma keying engine, among other things.

Given my choice without extraneous factors I'd use MSPro.

Dr. Mordrid

[Hulk]

If you are really going to do any video editing get MS Pro lite. Your time is worth much more than the hours you will waste on a cheap program.

[DarrenD]

OK I take your point.

I am looking at the UK websites for ADS Pyro 1394. I have yet to find out which MediaStudioPro version it is.

Is it worth upgrading to the full 6.5 or accept 6.0VE or 6.5VE? The 6.5 and 6.5VE seem to support PIII and P4 instructions. Does this mean 6.0VE will run like a dog?

Thanks very much

[gt40]

I beleive you can d/l a trial version if you would like to try mspro 6.5.

[DarrenD]

Thanks for the advice so far.

The ADS Pyro cards no longer come with MSP except for MSP Director's Cut for £199 (includes ADS card). However, I can buy MPS6.5 FULL for £205 (software only - no ADS card), Director's Cut for £135 (software only) or an upgrade of MPS5.0 (and higher versions) to 6.5 FULL for £88. It seems I might just have to find the cash!

I now refer you to my original questions.

Is the MPEG-2 encoding in MSP6.5 as good as TMPGEnc? If it is not then is it possible to frameserve from MSP6.5 to TMPGEnc? If I frameserved to TMPGEnc would I lose the ability to specify DVD chapters (am I making sense?). If the MPEG-2 encoding is as good then am I right in thinking MPS6.5 will do absolutely everything I need. By everything I mean:

1) Run under Win2K
2) Load multiple files easily (created by AVI-IO in Win98se)
3) Allow me to preview the project (in real-time) to find my start/stop points and cut out the intervening rubbish
4) Add fancy transitions around the start/stop points
5) Save the completed file to AVI over 4Gb (or split into multiple files) - not sure if I need this but I know VS6 said the file was too big
6) Save the completed file to MPEG-2 over 4Gb (for DVD-R burning)
7) Do DVD chapters to make a nice DVD-R so when I put a DVD-R in a DVD player it comes up with a title page and numbers for each particular date for my clips (e.g. 1 -> 2-Nov-2002, 2 -> 5-Nov-2002).

If the answers are as I expect... does anyone want to sell an old (but legal) version of MSP5.0 (or higher) so I can get the upgrade?

Thanks again.

[johnpr98]

Hi

PYRO 1394 Pro DVD is £149.99 at LynxDV

What's included:
• Pyro 1394 PCI Host card
• Six-pin to Four-pin DV cable
• Ulead DVD Workshop SE
• Ulead MediaStudio Pro Director's Cut
• Ulead DVD Picture Show

Worth a look IMHO

Regards

John

http://www.johnpr98.com

[DarrenD]

Is there any real significant difference between MSP6.5 FULL and MSP6.5 Director's Cut?

Thanks to johnpr98 I can get what he said for £150 (plus some bonus s/w from Lynx - OEM Nero 5.5 and PowerDVD XP). Alternatively I can get Pyro card, MSP6.0VE and Video Studio 5 (why when you get MSP???) for £55 from www.amazon.co.uk. Then for £88 from www.dabs.com I can get the upgrade to MSP6.5FULL.

Any suggestions? Both cost around £150. I am comparing 6.5FULL again 6.5DC, DVD Workshop SE, DVD Picture Show, Nero 5.5 plus PowerDVD XP.

In mind the 6.5DC bundle seems better value but if I end up having to upgrade to 6.5FULL it is going to be a false economy. Hence what do I really miss out on? The ulead website talks about missing Video Paint, CG Infinity, content CD and about 80 transitions and 35 video filters. Without having done video editing before I don't know whether these are extras I would not use.

Thanks again

[Dr Mordrid]

With MSP 6.5 full you get Video Paint (rotoscoping-draw on and manipulate frames) and CG Infinity (vector titler/animator). You might want to wait a few weeks though (hint-hint)

Transitions: the fades, slides and such you see between scenes.

Filters: used to manipulate video in many ways. Examples include changing the color balance, brightness, contrast or adding blurs, vignettes and the like.

Having lots of each expands your creative options.

Dr. Mordrid

[Brian Ellis]

Doc

I like the sound of your hint

[Dr Mordrid]

You should

BTW: I've tried to send you a PM about something but you have 'em disabled. Mail me.

Dr. Mordrid

[DarrenD]

OK

I guess I sit and wait for a bit.