Video Cap from Hi8

[Kooldino]

So I have ~$160 in gift cards to Best Buy, and I want to use it to buy something that will allow me to perfectly and simply capture my video from my analog Sony Handycam to my PC.

Here are my choices:

http://www.bestbuy.com/site/olspage.jsp?id=cat01054&type=category&navLevel=4&navHistory=cat00000%2Bcat01000%2Bcat01051

What do you guys think? Hear anything about any of these?

[Brian Ellis]

The problem is that these all seem to be USB devices. Equations: USB + video = disappointment; Firewire + video = happiness.

You may find something better under graphics cards with TV in, although the choice can be tricky.

Unfortunately, the choice with your retailer is VERY limited.

[Fluff]

not knowing an incredible amount but i would have thought that the one with realtime mpeg 2 encoding would be the best.

Pinnacle Systems Dazzle Digital Video Creator 150

Model: DVC-150



Capture your footage then take your production to the next level with this easy-to-use digital video creator.

Capture DVD-quality video from any digital camcorder, TV or VCR
Full 720 x 480 DVD resolution at 30 fps
DVD encoder chip converts video in real time to MPEG-2 format before saving to your hard drive, conserving space

[landrover]

Originally posted by Fluff
not knowing an incredible amount but i would have thought that the one with realtime mpeg 2 encoding would be the best.

Well, that depends on whether the card is capable of capturing I-frame only. Otherwise it will be pretty useless for convenient video-editing.
Assuming that your system is powerful enough, I'd suggest you get a capture device supporting the AVI-format.

[Kooldino]

What's I-frame all about?

I wasn't looking to edit with this...I just wanted to capture it, and then edit it on the PC.

BTW, I have 512M of RAM and an Athlon 1.7G

[LvR]

Capturing of video (via any capture solution) can be done in one of 2 ways:

You can do it in such a way that you have access to each individual frame making up your video you captured, or

You can do it in such a way that you access one complete frame, and any subsequent frames are derived from that frame by looking only at certain changes required to make up the subsequent frames - that one complete frame is called an I frame.

Most popular codecs like MJPeg, DV, Huff etc contain only I frames in the captured files they produce.

Stuff like Mpeg, Mpeg2, Mpeg4, DivX is of the second type where there is only an I frame about every 13 frames in the captured file - It implies that editing such a video stream requires a lot of unnecessary math in order to decode each individual frame, making editing rather CPU intensive and laborious - most all editing software hate editing these things, and edits performed on these type of files are generally of lower quality because you have to decode and re-encode - a sure way of degrading visual quality in general.

When you are editing a video stream containing only I frames, there is no such overhead calculations required and you have immediate access to each frame irrespective of where it is in the stream - any edit task performed involves only the particular frame you change and none of the successive ones.

So any capture card must be bought with the view to capture in such a way as to make your editing life easier on the PC............

I would try and get something able to capture in DV - something like the ADVC100 or the DAC100 both of wich I currently use - there is no drivers required and it simply works with any and all editing programs you care to mention via a standard 1394 interface under control of Windows .

If you are however looking at a choice out of those you have in the link only, I would go for the Pinnacle Moviebox USB based on some good reports ito quality of captured Mpegs (only format it can do) I have seen and experienced. I would give the Dazzles a complete miss. With the Pinnacle solutions you should be aware that they ONLY work under Pinnacle's Studio editing package and nowhere else because the clever people there decided to intentionally include the drivers for these devices in the actual editing package and not as standalone item - twits!.

[landrover]

....which is why I personally wouldn´t use Pinnacle as I cherish the freedom to choose whichever software I want.
Video editing is a mentally intensive and challenging type of business and I think you should use the tools which suit your personal taste best, not those that are mandatory for your hardware.
Which is why most users on this forum are using Ulead MediaStudio, although being aware that Matrox hardware is actually better optimized for Premiere.

[LvR]

Originally posted by landrover
....which is why I personally wouldn´t use Pinnacle as I cherish the freedom to choose whichever software I want.
Video editing is a mentally intensive and challenging type of business and I think you should use the tools which suit your personal taste best, not those that are mandatory for your hardware.
Which is why most users on this forum are using Ulead MediaStudio, although being aware that Matrox hardware is actually better optimized for Premiere.

Agreed absolutely - but then I didnt make up the selection on offer and place a limit on the price - I simply used that as a starting point.

[landrover]

Hi Lawrence

I just wanted to add my personal opinion, with no intention to question yours.

[Brian Ellis]

Personally, I'd avoid the Dazzle like the plague and my experience with Pinnacle is no better (I've just receive their latest offering with my DL burner: absolutely hopeless - now uninstalled and the registry cleaned.)

Quite frankly, I don't know which I'd choose out of the lists available from your retailer: I'd go elsewhere!

[Kooldino]

Man, I'm glad I asked you guys. I definitely DO NOT want to be limited to software.

How about a good tv tuner/capture card? Will it do what i need? I just want to cap 640x480 @ ~30fps max, without any studders or issues.

http://www.bestbuy.com/site/olspage.jsp?id=1077629691972&skuId=6539702&productCategoryId=cat01151&type=product

http://www.bestbuy.com/site/olspage.jsp?id=1051384142094&skuId=3705468&productCategoryId=cat01151&type=product

http://www.bestbuy.com/site/olspage.jsp?id=1091099665361&skuId=6742297&productCategoryId=cat01151&type=product

[LvR]

What exactly is your intention with the result of your editing aspirations?

You wanna make DVDs of that?
DivX?
Streaming?
Masters for later use?

All of that should be included in the decision.

[arciervo]

Originally posted by Kooldino
Man, I'm glad I asked you guys. I definitely DO NOT want to be limited to software.

How about a good tv tuner/capture card? Will it do what i need? I just want to cap 640x480 @ ~30fps max, without any studders or issues.

http://www.bestbuy.com/site/olspage.jsp?id=1077629691972&skuId=6539702&productCategoryId=cat01151&type=product

http://www.bestbuy.com/site/olspage.jsp?id=1051384142094&skuId=3705468&productCategoryId=cat01151&type=product

http://www.bestbuy.com/site/olspage....1&type=product

I have the first item in the list (the Hauppauge WinTV PVR-250) and love it. It does a very nice job of capturing MPEG-1 or MPEG-2 (at various bitrates) from the built-in analog tuner, S-video, or composite inputs. In addition to its basic software, it's well supported by various commercial (e.g. Beyond TV, Windows MCE) and freeware (e.g. Media Portal, GB-PVR) PVR packages. (All of these provide electronic programming guides and make it easy to schedule TV recordings.) The standard software includes Ulead DVD MovieFactory 2 SE, which is pretty decent for making DVDs.

However - as other posters have pointed out - if you wish to do any editing more advanced than simple cuts and trims, MPEG is probably not the way to go. (The Hauppauge card ONLY captures in MPEG.) Even frame-accurate cuts will require purchase of additional software (I recommend VideoReDo) since the supplied WinTV-Editor is not up to the task. BTW, fuller-featured MPEG editors are available (e.g. Womble MPEG Video Wizard) but they're pricey.

For my purposes, the PVR-250 is great. I can schedule recordings of TV programs weeks ahead of time and have them saved to my hard drive. (The load on my 2.4 GHz PC is negligible and I can do other things at the same time.) I edit out the commercials with VideoRedo and author DVDs using Ulead DVD Movie Factory. Although I haven't got around to it yet, I'm planning to capture my home videos from my Hi-8 camcorder (via S-video), edit out the stuff I don't need (no fancy effects), and burn DVDs.

If you can live with the limitations of the MPEG format, I think you would appreciate the versatility of a TV tuner-hardware encoder as compared to a dedicated capture card.

Tony

[Kooldino]

Originally posted by LvR
What exactly is your intention with the result of your editing aspirations?

You wanna make DVDs of that?
DivX?
Streaming?
Masters for later use?

All of that should be included in the decision.

I just want to make DivX videos with some light editing that are flawlessly smooth at 640x480.

[Kooldino]

Originally posted by arciervo
I have the first item in the list (the Hauppauge WinTV PVR-250) and love it. It does a very nice job of capturing MPEG-1 or MPEG-2 (at various bitrates) from the built-in analog tuner, S-video, or composite inputs. In addition to its basic software, it's well supported by various commercial (e.g. Beyond TV, Windows MCE) and freeware (e.g. Media Portal, GB-PVR) PVR packages. (All of these provide electronic programming guides and make it easy to schedule TV recordings.) The standard software includes Ulead DVD MovieFactory 2 SE, which is pretty decent for making DVDs.

Awesome.

However - as other posters have pointed out - if you wish to do any editing more advanced than simple cuts and trims, MPEG is probably not the way to go. (The Hauppauge card ONLY captures in MPEG.)

Well, I do only want to do simple cuts and intros and such.

Can it capture in an MPEG format that isn't really lossy that I can easily convert into DivX or something?

Even frame-accurate cuts will require purchase of additional software (I recommend VideoReDo) since the supplied WinTV-Editor is not up to the task.

Could I use virtualdub to add a key frame where I want to cut it and do so?

BTW, fuller-featured MPEG editors are available (e.g. Womble MPEG Video Wizard) but they're pricey.

I'd just be looking into free programs aside from the software that comes with it. If I run ~30fps and I can only cut every 13 frames or so, I could probably deal with it.

For my purposes, the PVR-250 is great. I can schedule recordings of TV programs weeks ahead of time and have them saved to my hard drive. (The load on my 2.4 GHz PC is negligible and I can do other things at the same time.) I edit out the commercials with VideoRedo and author DVDs using Ulead DVD Movie Factory. Although I haven't got around to it yet, I'm planning to capture my home videos from my Hi-8 camcorder (via S-video), edit out the stuff I don't need (no fancy effects), and burn DVDs.

Exactly what I'm looking to do. Splendid.

If you can live with the limitations of the MPEG format, I think you would appreciate the versatility of a TV tuner-hardware encoder as compared to a dedicated capture card.

Tony

Awesome, thanks for the write up.