Cheap Digital Camera

[az]

For that kind of money I'd get myself a Minolta Dimage F100/F200/F300. These cameras are very underrated, have good image quality, nice design, are small, have manual controls...

The F100 can be had for 344 EUR in germany, which is a steal for a quality 4mp cam. It's last year's model, thus so cheap.

I'd get the F200 though, it costs only a little more (391 EUR) but is a good evolutionary step forward. Sadly it has those ugly plastic parts.

The F300 is too expensive (467.40 EUR), IMHO, because you really don't need 5mp over 4, which is all it has over the F200.

AZ

[VJ]

A friend of mine is now considering the Canon A70. It is a 3 MP, but it allows all automatic settings to be overridden (manual focus, P, S, A and M shooting modes, ...). It is also somewhere in the F100 price category.


Jörg

[az]

It's a good cam from what I hear.

BTW, the single most important feature and buying decision for any camera is how it feels to you. So, by all means, go to a store that stocks it and play with it a little. Shoot some pictures (or pretend, if they have no memory card around), play with the menus, try the zoom (often, it's horrible and has only like 4 steps), try the manual features... Then buy online at the cheapest shop you can find

This is really what made me get the Dimage 7i - the manual zoom ring and focus ring around the lens barrel make shooting feel much more natural (it feels much more like your cam, VJ, than any pocket digicam ever could), and the quick access to all vital functions over knobs, buttons and wheels rather than manus is nice, too. I also tried Fuji's bigger digicams with the 6x zoom lenses, but their hand grip was too long for my small hands, so I wouldn't have bought one even if they were the best cams there are.

AZ

[VJ]

BTW, the single most important feature and buying decision for any camera is how it feels to you. So, by all means, go to a store that stocks it and play with it a little. Shoot some pictures (or pretend, if they have no memory card around), play with the menus, try the zoom (often, it's horrible and has only like 4 steps), try the manual features...

I couldn't agree more.

Reading your comment on the Dimage 7i made me laugh: I had my heart set on the Dimage 7 (the first version that was launched), but decided no to get it after a hands-on test: it didn't feel that comfortable to hold (to me, but I suffer from artritis in my fingers - but I think the grip in the 7i has been improved) and I didn't really like the EVF (to low a framerate IMO, and difficult to see with glasses - diopter correction is not an option as it cannot be set strong enough + cannot correct astigmatism). So I then decided to wait another year, and when the D100 came out, I knew what to get.

Then buy online at the cheapest shop you can find

I wouldn't completely agree here... I'd rather pay a bit more to make sure I can get decent support and warranty (many manufacturers to make problems of equipment not bought in the same country or region). Esp. as digital cameras can suffer from stuck pixels, which is fully covered under warranty.


Jörg

[Dr Mordrid]

At the cheaper end you have the Nikon Coolpix 2000.

2.11 MP, 3x optical zoom, F/L = 5.8-17.4 mm, 16 MB internal etc.

Streets at about $130 USD.

Dr. Mordrid

[GNEP]

Thanks for the suggestion Doc - the Coolpix 2100 is £180 incl. VAT here in the UK (US-UK comparisons are always nasty!).

I've been watching this thread with interest as I might be in the market for a cheap (£150ish) digital camera soon.

[az]

VJ: Yes, the 7i's grip has improved, and the 7Hi's grip has improved over that one (finally, it's real rubber). And yes, the EVF is BAAAD on the D7, especially the colors and sharpness. But to be honest, I use the LCD almost all of the time anyway, a feature I'd greatly miss on a DSLR.

I WOULD buy a camera from a camera store if I had the money, but I could get the Dimage for 820 EUR on the net (german model, so no warranty problems), and my local store wanted 1400 EUR for it!! Even if I was a millionnaire, I'd not do that. But of course it's unfair to buy something on the net and then expect service from the camera shop in your street from which you haven't bought the cam - service costs money, too, that's why they are more expensive.

GNEP: The canon PowerShot A60 appears just slightly above your price range (if you find a cheap online shop), and I think it's a good camera. I'd really advice you to spend a little more and get a 3mp model (though NEVER get a cheap 3mp over a good 2mp, or a cheap 4mp over a good 3mp), like the Canon A70. (Though for the same price you can get a Minolta Dimage F100, which is an excellent small and stylish 4mp camera with optional manual controls and a 3x zoom).

AZ

[GNEP]

Thanks for the advice az - I'll have a look around. In no real hurry - just "one of those things I'd like to have"

[VJ]

az: That is where we differ: I couldn't do without a decent viewfinder... (The one on the D100 is a bit small, but apart from that, great. Funny comment from my friends (who are more into compact cameras): "Hey, looking through this viewfinder is like a videogame" )
Also, about the online shops: €600 is of course a big difference (and as the warranty is correct, little risk involved), I don't think I'd hesitate where to buy it .

GNEP: The dpreview website has been mentioned, another good site is http://www.steves-digicams.com (I have a feeling dpreview tends to test more high-range cameras, whereas this site does have a number of new low-range models)

[GNEP]

Yup VJ - I checked out dpreview already and it definitely felt like they were NOT in my market segment. steves-digicams looks interesting though - thanks!

[VJ]

You might also find stuff here:

http://www.imaging-resource.com/

Jörg

[az]

There's also http://imaging-resource.com/, but I think they tend to be not quite critical enough (while dpreview is too critical, but that's good, as you can pick out for yourself which points are important to you). imaging resource have a nice tool to compare two cameras' images, but I don't really like their test images.

AZ

[GNEP]

And what about stuff like memory formats - I have no other flash memory devices, so does it really matter?

[Dr Mordrid]

You haven't shot digital 'til you've done it with a Mamiya RB67 + digital back

I wish I could afford the Phase One 7k x 7k

Dr. Mordrid

[az]

Not really. I don't like Memory Sticks, because they are expensive and proprietary, and only the Memory Stick Pro can have a capacity greater than 128 MB, which isn't all that much. Only this year's devices (plus the F717 and the FX77 or so) are MS Pro compatible.

Compact Flash is cheapest, rugged, and the "professional" choice (it's used in most higher-end cams). They have built-in controllers, so their PCMCIA adaptor is very cheap. There's a big speed difference between, say, a SanDisk non-ultra and a Lexar 40x. Some cameras have compatibility problems with non-brand name stuff (which I wouldn't buy anyway).

SD is slowly being phased out, I think. I also think they're quite thin, and thus easy to bend (thus destroy).

XD Picture card is the new standard for mid-level consumer digicams, I think, ut I don't like it. These things are so small! They're available with up to 256 MB now I think, but Olympus say they will have capacities up to 8 GB.

AZ