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Well, as some of you were as kind as to help me out on a number of things, I thought some of you might find it nice to read a laymans’review on a hybrid source device: the Denon DVD-2900. It’s been with me for about 6 weeks now I think and I have been playing around a bit with it. I’ll be talking about some other stuff as well, but somewhere in here, you’ll find some of my thoughts on this machine.
The Denon DVD-2900 (the “2900â€) is a hybrid DVD-Video/DVD-Audio/CD/SACD player. I will not be saying much about DVD-Video (I only bought it for audio with the video as a “free†bonus) or DVD-Audio (ain’t got one yet…). So it’ll be on CD and SACD (sort of high definiton CD, see below). mostly. But first:
When I decided to order the 2900, I ordered a few SACD’s, as it would not make sense to buy a SACD player and then not have any SACD’s, now would it.
Sure enough, “Tommy†in a Deluxe Edition came in right after it was released. I put it in my player, was not really paying attention, and then all of a sudden: WOW! This was, for those who know the album, during “Christmas†after about 2 minutes, when they go silent and the guys goes “Tommy, can you hear meâ€. After each time he sings this, they will stike a chord on the guitar which then fades away. The way this guitar sounded, the way it fades, it was unbelievable and completly different and better (IMO). One problem though, my 2900 had not arrived yet. This was on my old Denon DCM-440, a 5-CD changer….
As it turns out, Pete Townsend finally found the original master tapes….The CD I had was engineered from the tapes (what are they called, the ones they use to mix the final tape) as the original master was deemed to be lost. They tried to make it sound as much as the original as they could…I can now say: They Failed!
And the moral is: No matter how bad your equipment, a bad recording can’t be helped. (A case in point is “Walking into Clarksdale by, uhm, them two guys from Led Zeppelin. Great music, good lyrics, mediocre rythym section and awful engineering. Those guys mixing it together really committed murder.)
BREAKING IN THE 2900
I never really believe audio equipments needs to be broken in (with the possible exception of speakers), although I experience it myself every time I buy something new (like one in 5 years). I remember also having to break in my Amp, even though it was a demo from the shop which had over 100 hours of play when I bought it…..IMO, it is more breaking in ones ears to adept to the new device than anything else. So yeah, the 2900 sounded more pleasant over the first few weeks after a good start already.
2900 – CD quality
Some reviews I’ve read, both professionals and end-users, disliked the 2900 as CD player. I disagree with them. I did so when I compared it to my old DCM-440, but ok, it should sound better than that one, right?
I don’t think I will ever understand how manufacturers are able to get their own distinctive sound. I imagine (?) it is quite clear that the 2900 “tries†to bring forth the same sound as the 440, it just does it better. Especially, and this was a surprise to me, in the lows. It is also “better defined†as, for example, in “Carpet Crawlers†by Genesis (from The Lamb Lies Down In Broadwayâ€), where Peter Gabriels’ voice needs to come out in front, the 2900 really puts him there. With the 440, when he sings in a low voice “the carpet crawlers†alongside with the backing vocals, PG just is not as forthcoming, as pronounced as with the 2900.
One guy was saying CD quality of the 2900 was poor, but much better when using the “audio direct†mode….. I’m sure he’s right, but I doubt it. I don’t hear any difference between audio direct or not (and yes, I did set audio direct up correctly).
2900 – SACD
WTH is SACD? Some compare it to the enhanced PCM format used on DVD-Audio discs, i.e. 24 bits at 96 or 192 Khz (as opposed to CD, 16 bits at 44.1 or somesuch Khz). It is correct in one respect, being that SACD and DVD-Audio are comparable, albeit just a tad inferior, with respect to S/N-Ratio and dynamic range figures. SACD however also uses a different encoding thing called Delta-Sigma Decoding (DSD). Now I know shit about this stuff, but apparently, the DSD has a higher resolution at the points in a wave form where our ears are most sensitive, i.e. it supposedly is more efficient as it better caputures that part of sound the we hear best.
So what does it sound like? Is it better than CD? Hell Yes, BUT, it varies greatly depending on what you use to compare it with.
In my experience, the biggest difference is in the highs, it’s in high-hats for instance where, when you really listen, the high-hats sound more like puffs of noise than actual copper or whatever metal plates hit against each other or hit with a piece of wood or where they use triangels.
One album where you will hear the difference rather clearly is “Spirit of Eden†by Talk Talk. Even clearer is the difference on “Up†by Peter Gabriel, but that album, I think, is also heavily engineered (no compression fortunately), so it’s hard to say what it is you are supposed to hear.
I’ve listened to a few SACD’s comparing the SACD-layer and the CD-layer on the same player. Aside form this difference in the high’s, I don’t really hear any difference at all. But, when listening to music for a longer time, say over an hour, it does get less tiring. With CD’s, I do get the feeling that it “misses out†occasionally in the highs. With SACD, I don’t have that.
2900 vs Marantz SA-1
I took my 2900 (and speakers and cables) to a friend of mine in Heidelberg when I visited him for a long weekend the other weekend. He owns a Marantz SA-1 that, AFAIK, is still known as one of the best SACD players known.
The difference with the 2900 is very clear, but it is not in anyway that we’d say “betterâ€. Denon is known, AFAIK, to be somewhat aggressive: the highs are more pronounced, a bit “sharpâ€. This was clearly audible when comparing with the SA-1, which sounded “softerâ€. I am not yet decided on which I like better in this respect. I like vocal(ish) work a lot though, and the 2900’s intepretation of “Army Dreamers†by Kate Bush (CD) was nicer, as well as with “Lamento della Ninfa†(Monteverdi) by the Netherlands Bach Society (SACD).
We concluded it was a matter of taste really, nothing else. The SA-1 BTW has balanced outputs (XLR) and we used them. Can’t say they make a lot of difference, if any at all.
2900 – Video
As said, I did not buy it for this, ‘twas just a bonus. It seems just fine to me, definately better than the VHS recorder I use and I think it is better than our cable TV receipt as well. This using a 10-year old Sony CRT TV. Have not seen much on it yet though, uhm, Matrix Revolutions (which sucked) and some episodes of “Dr. Quinn: Medicine Womanâ€.
That was a bit strange actually, Dr. Quinn is only available in region code 1 DVD. So I had to make my player region free as it was a region 2 player. Just before I went and put in the CD with region-free firmware, I thought I might as well look what happens if I put a R1 DVD in it. Played like a charm.....Almost went and fixed while it wasn’t broke.
Cables
We also compared my 6 euro/m 4mm^2 bi-wiring setup (copper for bass, silvered for mid/high) with my friends $45/m bi wiring setup. No difference we could discover. That is not to say cables don’t make any difference at all: I do not think I hear any difference between my 4mm^2 bi-wire setup and the 2.5mm^2 bi-wire I had before (so, yeah, I screwed myself). But when I went from 2.5mm^2 copper mono-wire to 2.5mm^2 copper/silvered bi-wire, the change was very very clear. Quite an improvement.
Conclusion
I like this player a lot. Wrt CD, it is definately an improvement over my Denon DCM-440 (which by no means is anything near high-end I guess). It compares well with an expensive player, the Marantz SA-1. The choice between the two, IMO, is really a matter of taste. SACD performance, comparing to the SA-1 yields the same. I’m sure better CD players are out there, but at what price? As a play-it-all machine, it delivers good quality for the price and there will be many other players that should not impress you more than this one (again, assuming you like the Denon sound).
I don’t do reviews, so I don’t know how to go about. Anything I missed or you’d like me to talk about, post it here and I’ll see what I can do (although it may take a while).
Equipment used:
2900 – DCM-440 comparison:
CD – Denon DCM-440
SACD – Denon DVD-2900
Amp – van Medevoort MA-111
Speakers – Quadral Shogun (Phonoloque Gold series, they made A LOT OF Shogun neamed speakers)
2900 – SA-1 comparison
2900 – Denon DVD-2900
SA-1 – Marantz SA-1 (had not figured that out yet, eh?)
Pre-Amp – Sonic Frontiers Line 3
Power-Amp – 2 x Monarchy SM-70 Pro
Speakers – Quadral Shogun and JBL L7
The Denon DVD-2900 (the “2900â€) is a hybrid DVD-Video/DVD-Audio/CD/SACD player. I will not be saying much about DVD-Video (I only bought it for audio with the video as a “free†bonus) or DVD-Audio (ain’t got one yet…). So it’ll be on CD and SACD (sort of high definiton CD, see below). mostly. But first:
When I decided to order the 2900, I ordered a few SACD’s, as it would not make sense to buy a SACD player and then not have any SACD’s, now would it.
Sure enough, “Tommy†in a Deluxe Edition came in right after it was released. I put it in my player, was not really paying attention, and then all of a sudden: WOW! This was, for those who know the album, during “Christmas†after about 2 minutes, when they go silent and the guys goes “Tommy, can you hear meâ€. After each time he sings this, they will stike a chord on the guitar which then fades away. The way this guitar sounded, the way it fades, it was unbelievable and completly different and better (IMO). One problem though, my 2900 had not arrived yet. This was on my old Denon DCM-440, a 5-CD changer….
As it turns out, Pete Townsend finally found the original master tapes….The CD I had was engineered from the tapes (what are they called, the ones they use to mix the final tape) as the original master was deemed to be lost. They tried to make it sound as much as the original as they could…I can now say: They Failed!
And the moral is: No matter how bad your equipment, a bad recording can’t be helped. (A case in point is “Walking into Clarksdale by, uhm, them two guys from Led Zeppelin. Great music, good lyrics, mediocre rythym section and awful engineering. Those guys mixing it together really committed murder.)
BREAKING IN THE 2900
I never really believe audio equipments needs to be broken in (with the possible exception of speakers), although I experience it myself every time I buy something new (like one in 5 years). I remember also having to break in my Amp, even though it was a demo from the shop which had over 100 hours of play when I bought it…..IMO, it is more breaking in ones ears to adept to the new device than anything else. So yeah, the 2900 sounded more pleasant over the first few weeks after a good start already.
2900 – CD quality
Some reviews I’ve read, both professionals and end-users, disliked the 2900 as CD player. I disagree with them. I did so when I compared it to my old DCM-440, but ok, it should sound better than that one, right?
I don’t think I will ever understand how manufacturers are able to get their own distinctive sound. I imagine (?) it is quite clear that the 2900 “tries†to bring forth the same sound as the 440, it just does it better. Especially, and this was a surprise to me, in the lows. It is also “better defined†as, for example, in “Carpet Crawlers†by Genesis (from The Lamb Lies Down In Broadwayâ€), where Peter Gabriels’ voice needs to come out in front, the 2900 really puts him there. With the 440, when he sings in a low voice “the carpet crawlers†alongside with the backing vocals, PG just is not as forthcoming, as pronounced as with the 2900.
One guy was saying CD quality of the 2900 was poor, but much better when using the “audio direct†mode….. I’m sure he’s right, but I doubt it. I don’t hear any difference between audio direct or not (and yes, I did set audio direct up correctly).
2900 – SACD
WTH is SACD? Some compare it to the enhanced PCM format used on DVD-Audio discs, i.e. 24 bits at 96 or 192 Khz (as opposed to CD, 16 bits at 44.1 or somesuch Khz). It is correct in one respect, being that SACD and DVD-Audio are comparable, albeit just a tad inferior, with respect to S/N-Ratio and dynamic range figures. SACD however also uses a different encoding thing called Delta-Sigma Decoding (DSD). Now I know shit about this stuff, but apparently, the DSD has a higher resolution at the points in a wave form where our ears are most sensitive, i.e. it supposedly is more efficient as it better caputures that part of sound the we hear best.
So what does it sound like? Is it better than CD? Hell Yes, BUT, it varies greatly depending on what you use to compare it with.
In my experience, the biggest difference is in the highs, it’s in high-hats for instance where, when you really listen, the high-hats sound more like puffs of noise than actual copper or whatever metal plates hit against each other or hit with a piece of wood or where they use triangels.
One album where you will hear the difference rather clearly is “Spirit of Eden†by Talk Talk. Even clearer is the difference on “Up†by Peter Gabriel, but that album, I think, is also heavily engineered (no compression fortunately), so it’s hard to say what it is you are supposed to hear.
I’ve listened to a few SACD’s comparing the SACD-layer and the CD-layer on the same player. Aside form this difference in the high’s, I don’t really hear any difference at all. But, when listening to music for a longer time, say over an hour, it does get less tiring. With CD’s, I do get the feeling that it “misses out†occasionally in the highs. With SACD, I don’t have that.
2900 vs Marantz SA-1
I took my 2900 (and speakers and cables) to a friend of mine in Heidelberg when I visited him for a long weekend the other weekend. He owns a Marantz SA-1 that, AFAIK, is still known as one of the best SACD players known.
The difference with the 2900 is very clear, but it is not in anyway that we’d say “betterâ€. Denon is known, AFAIK, to be somewhat aggressive: the highs are more pronounced, a bit “sharpâ€. This was clearly audible when comparing with the SA-1, which sounded “softerâ€. I am not yet decided on which I like better in this respect. I like vocal(ish) work a lot though, and the 2900’s intepretation of “Army Dreamers†by Kate Bush (CD) was nicer, as well as with “Lamento della Ninfa†(Monteverdi) by the Netherlands Bach Society (SACD).
We concluded it was a matter of taste really, nothing else. The SA-1 BTW has balanced outputs (XLR) and we used them. Can’t say they make a lot of difference, if any at all.
2900 – Video
As said, I did not buy it for this, ‘twas just a bonus. It seems just fine to me, definately better than the VHS recorder I use and I think it is better than our cable TV receipt as well. This using a 10-year old Sony CRT TV. Have not seen much on it yet though, uhm, Matrix Revolutions (which sucked) and some episodes of “Dr. Quinn: Medicine Womanâ€.
That was a bit strange actually, Dr. Quinn is only available in region code 1 DVD. So I had to make my player region free as it was a region 2 player. Just before I went and put in the CD with region-free firmware, I thought I might as well look what happens if I put a R1 DVD in it. Played like a charm.....Almost went and fixed while it wasn’t broke.
Cables
We also compared my 6 euro/m 4mm^2 bi-wiring setup (copper for bass, silvered for mid/high) with my friends $45/m bi wiring setup. No difference we could discover. That is not to say cables don’t make any difference at all: I do not think I hear any difference between my 4mm^2 bi-wire setup and the 2.5mm^2 bi-wire I had before (so, yeah, I screwed myself). But when I went from 2.5mm^2 copper mono-wire to 2.5mm^2 copper/silvered bi-wire, the change was very very clear. Quite an improvement.
Conclusion
I like this player a lot. Wrt CD, it is definately an improvement over my Denon DCM-440 (which by no means is anything near high-end I guess). It compares well with an expensive player, the Marantz SA-1. The choice between the two, IMO, is really a matter of taste. SACD performance, comparing to the SA-1 yields the same. I’m sure better CD players are out there, but at what price? As a play-it-all machine, it delivers good quality for the price and there will be many other players that should not impress you more than this one (again, assuming you like the Denon sound).
I don’t do reviews, so I don’t know how to go about. Anything I missed or you’d like me to talk about, post it here and I’ll see what I can do (although it may take a while).
Equipment used:
2900 – DCM-440 comparison:
CD – Denon DCM-440
SACD – Denon DVD-2900
Amp – van Medevoort MA-111
Speakers – Quadral Shogun (Phonoloque Gold series, they made A LOT OF Shogun neamed speakers)
2900 – SA-1 comparison
2900 – Denon DVD-2900
SA-1 – Marantz SA-1 (had not figured that out yet, eh?)
Pre-Amp – Sonic Frontiers Line 3
Power-Amp – 2 x Monarchy SM-70 Pro
Speakers – Quadral Shogun and JBL L7
for the review
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