iPod alternatives?

[az]

I am thinking about buying an iPod 5G 30GB. I've also looked at some alternatives, because I don't like some things about the iPod, but have found none that do all I'd want: I want a portable mp3 player with at least 20GB of space, and with either some kind of docking station and remote, or with wireless streaming of music in hi-fi quality (read: as if it weren't wireless) to something compatible with a home stereo (line out or S/P-DIF).

Does there even exist an mp3 player that does this? I know one with a remote and docking station, the nice looking Philips unit. But I've read bad things about its sound quality, and it also doesn't work as a USB mass storage device, so I don't really see an advantage over the iPod here.

I would be using this player as a "Walkman", and as my primary source of music with high-quality, EAC-ripped mp3s, either through a home stereo system with speakers or my beloved Sennheiser HD595, so sound quality is important. This would be a CD player replacement.

Any suggestions?

[Jessterw]

I know a few people who have been happy with ones from iRiver, though I'm not sure if any meet all your requirements.

An iPod would meet all your requirements save for the high quality part. Even if you have perfectly ripped mp3s, once you transfer them to an iPod, the quality will not be as pristine as the source. Not to say the sound quality would be bad or less than adequate, but pumping through stereo speakers will definitely lead one to notice the difference. Through headphones, not so much.

[az]

Damn.

[Holster]

You can get a cradle and remote for the irivers. I have 2 H10's that i'm more than happy with

[dbdg]

I love my Creative Zen Touch

[Sasq]

no matter what you do, you will loose some quality.
as for the ipods, or any other mp3 player, your best bet, is to go to a decent store, that also sells docking stations etc, and listen to the output over the docking station/speakers/stereo

[Claymonkey]

I had an iRiver H340 and LOVED it. Unfortunately, it was lifted from my bag on the Train in Boston. They have since stopped making them and the H10 isn't as feature rich as I'd like. I've since replaced it with the Iaudio X5 and it seems to have all the features of the H340 in a smaller package. The audio of both as been far better than ipods I've listened to. That and both have had Line-outs instead of relying on the headphone jack. Quality wise you will always been limited to what you ripped and converted the music into and the settings used. Also it just shows up as a drive on your computer when plugged in as works as a USB2GO device. Both also work with RockBox (an open source system.. highly interesting).

The X5 has a cradle and a wired remote (both sold seperately). I'm honestly unsure of whether there is a wireless remote for it. Though finding a remote easily for anything other than an ipod might be hard to do.

X5 page -> http://www.cowonamerica.com/products/iaudio/x5/
RockBox -> http://www.rockbox.org/
Iriver community -> http://www.misticriver.net/
Iaudio community -> http://www.iaudiophile.net/news.php

[Jessterw]

Far better? I'll have to argue against that given I have an iPod shuffle, and even it has sound quality that's almost on par with a few different players I've listened to, including an iRiver model. Not saying that an iRiver might not have better sound, but I think saying it's far better is a bit of an overstatement.

And iPod's don't all rely soley on the headphone jack for audio out, they also use the dock connector.

[az]

I think I've read somewhere that ironically, the shuffle has the best audio quality of the iPods. I wouldn't be concerned for mobile use, but since it would be my primary music source at home, I am.

Since this all reeks of compromise, the new plan is to get a network mp3 player with display (Squeezebox or SoundBridge - any comments or other recommendations? The first to mention the noxon gets slapped!), and just get some small flash mp3 player for outdoors. And to somewhere find the money for all that.

[Claymonkey]

Far better? I'll have to argue against that given I have an iPod shuffle, and even it has sound quality that's almost on par with a few different players I've listened to, including an iRiver model. Not saying that an iRiver might not have better sound, but I think saying it's far better is a bit of an overstatement.

And iPod's don't all rely soley on the headphone jack for audio out, they also use the dock connector.

Honestly i haven't heard the shuffles or the G5 ipods. Only the first 4 versions. You and I have had this conversation before I'm just saying that 'I' noticed the difference between my iriver at the time and an ipod photo and I'd say the difference was in the range of going from 128 to 160 bit rate. Same headphones, same song. I'd be willing to do a double blind test on that one.

[Whirl-Secret]

I have a G5 iPod video 30Gb (black) and it's great. Sound quality is fabulous because I rip my cds into the apple lossless format and I bought some Etymotic er6i earphones. In fact that's getting very close to perfect reproduction imho. I can easily tell the difference between lame preset extreme (around 230-250 kbps vbr) and 320kbps cbr mp3s, and I can also tell the difference between 320kbps and lossless (the bass is slightly fuller on lossless).

I've never had any other mp3 player apart from a nokia 6230 with default headphones, so I'd say the sound quality on my iPod setup is incredible. Definitely any speakers would be the weak link, if I got them.

Just thought I needed to defend the quality of the ipod, although you do need to spend a lot of money (er6i headphones) and effort (lossless ripping, 128kbps mp3s are banned!) to get there. But what did you expect?

[Claymonkey]

Oh I agree and I avoid 128 like the plague. However, I do know plenty of people that can't tell or don't care about the difference. Personally I try not to have or get music below 192kbps these days and prefer higher.

[Whirl-Secret]

Yes I know many would say that >= 192 kbps is all the same, but I wonder how they listen to the music. The Etymotics make my pc headphones (Sennheiser HD497) sound horrendous, which is quite upsetting for me, because I used to like them :P

Edit: They make such a difference, that on a cd you know well they might change your favourite song because you hear them so differently. There are some drawbacks though... having to replace filters and clean the heads...

[az]

Please let's not drift completely off topic.

BTW, if you are able to hear the difference between 320Kbps LAME mp3s and uncompressed in a double blind test, you have a hearing anomaly. I don't say this to discredit or insult you, it's just that no ordinary human with good hearing can do that, but people with certain hearing defects can, because mp3 is a psychoacoustic method that drops sound that is masked by other sounds, and if a person can't hear the masking sounds, they may very well hear the absence of the sound that ordinary listeners would not have heard behind the masking sounds, and was therefore dropped by the compression. I hope I wasn't too confusing now, it's late and I realize I've written quite a long sentence

[TnT]

Check out iAudio's offerings. They have an impressive selection of items with nice features (ogg support whoo!). I don't own any myself but eyeing a flash player to take to the gym.