video file conversion

[VJ]

I'm stumped....

I have some XVid files that I would really like to convert for my iPod, but I can't manage. Windows Media Player plays back the files without issues; Super can play back the XVid file, but cannot convert it to any other format (with or without DirectShow). And Quicktime cannot play back the file.
I have tried installing the latest XVidcodec, but to no avail. I'm now thinking of converting it using Virtualdub to a different compressor, in the hope that Quicktime could manage. But I can't get Virtualdub to open the file...

I am using Vista Ulimate, with the latest ac3filter and the latest xvid installed.

Any suggestions?


Jörg

[dZeus]

xvid, =mpeg 4 asp. I don't know if the ipod can playback that codec (my guess is it can?). If it can, you probably need to change the container format (if it's in avi right now) to a quicktime container. mplayer (mencoder more specifically) probably can do that among other programs.

The reason why virtualdub won't open the file (if it's avi), is probably because you haven't got the vfw xvid codec installed, just the directshow playback filter needed for directshow playback (like WMP does).

[VJ]

Yes, it is an avi file...
I have installed this xvid codec. But do I need to adjust some settings in Virtualdub to find it?

I'll download mplayer, to see if that can help me.


Jörg

[dZeus]

I don't think virtualdub is going to do you any good, as it can't handle quicktime containers last time I checked.

Use mencoder (in mplayer) to only change the container format. Transcoding the video most likely only is going to lower the quality, as the ipod probably can play back mpeg4 asp in the first place.

[VJ]

Thanks, I'll give it a go...

But I'm still puzzled as to why the conversion with Super fails....
FWIW, I cannot convert this XVID to any format using Super (with or without directshow enabled), so I'm assuming the problem lies in reading the file. But the error doesn't appear immediatly (a file of about 15 MB has been created!). EDIT: Oh, and it can play back the file...


Jörg

[Gurm]

I'm going to guess that the file might actually be broken. Not so bad it can't be played, but converters usually scan the whole file first. Have you tried opening it in VirtualDub yet? Usually that'll tell you if there's a problem!

[VJ]

I tried with MediaCoder (which actually is a frontend to mencoder). First I just choose to copy the video stream, but this results in a file that opens in Quicktime, but doesn't play back well (low framerate, huge compression artefacts, ...). When I chose to re-encode the video stream (and set it to 25fps from its current 23.98), the resulting file works like a charm in Quicktime!

Could well be that the file is broken... but mencoder managed to salvage it...

FWIW, Virtualdub simply can't open the file (I think it is unable to find a suitable decoder).


Jörg

[Gurm]

I tried with MediaCoder (which actually is a frontend to mencoder). First I just choose to copy the video stream, but this results in a file that opens in Quicktime, but doesn't play back well (low framerate, huge compression artefacts, ...). When I chose to re-encode the video stream (and set it to 25fps from its current 23.98), the resulting file works like a charm in Quicktime!

Could well be that the file is broken... but mencoder managed to salvage it...

FWIW, Virtualdub simply can't open the file (I think it is unable to find a suitable decoder).


Jörg

Sounds like you've got an xvid decoder problem, to boot. I'd do a codec cleanup if I were you. Is G-Spot in your arsenal? Latest versions of that have a "show me all my codecs" tool, in addition to it showing you what decoders are rendering a given file. Also there are several good tools to check codec/decoder priorities and modify them if necessary!

[VJ]

Sounds like you've got an xvid decoder problem, to boot. I'd do a codec cleanup if I were you. Is G-Spot in your arsenal? Latest versions of that have a "show me all my codecs" tool, in addition to it showing you what decoders are rendering a given file. Also there are several good tools to check codec/decoder priorities and modify them if necessary!

I've only installed fddshow and xvid. No other decoders are installed or have been installed.

The Super software uses its own internal codecs, so isn't dependent on the installed codecs (and it should support xvid). I haven't run the auxsetup utility with Virtualdub (dunno if that makes a huge difference).
I also have found some references that hint at problems with divx and xvid codecs on Vista...


Jörg

[Gurm]

OH ... VISTA.

*ahem* you didn't SAY that!

Vista has all KINDS of codec issues. Seriously, get G-Spot:

http://gspot.headbands.com

[VJ]

OH ... VISTA.

*ahem* you didn't SAY that!

Yes, in my first post....

Vista has all KINDS of codec issues. Seriously, get G-Spot:

http://gspot.headbands.com

Thanks, will check it out!


Jörg

[Gurm]

Yes, in my first post....

Oh, hey yeah look at that! I'm ... well, Claymonkey insists that I'm really not on top of my game the past few days... not sleeping well or something.

Thanks, will check it out!

Yeah, ok I'm going to try to explain this without sounding retarded, which is hard after not sleeping. So...

Each FourCC code doesn't have a specific decoder definitively attached to it. What that means is that when you try to render something with the FourCC "xvid", you aren't necessarily getting the xvid decoder! Instead, what happens is that the media subsystem is queried for which decoder should render the file.

Each decoder has a FourCC list that it "can handle", and in addition also has a "weight" assigned to it. Weights are supposed to range from 0x00 to 0x08. However, due to poor installation programs (and sometimes due to Windows' buggy media code!) you'll often find a decoder with a weight MUCH higher than 0x08! Nero, for instance, loves to install its filters (which are admittedly much better than NO filter, but nowhere near as good as the CORRECT filter) with a weight of 0xFF.

There are also other factors which Windows uses to determine which decoder gets to render a file. The price of tea in china, whether the clothes you're wearing coordinate well, or even a complex series of numerological and meteorological calculations. I often refer to this as Windows' "mood". I'm sure someone somewhere knows the specifics of this calculation, but I sure don't!

There ARE other factors though. If Windows thinks that a decoder might be "busy" (how that is possible in a multistreaming, multithreaded, multiple-instance OS is beyond me) then it lowers its weight. *ahem*

Last but not least, the decoder itself can have compatibility issues!

In your case, I think you're seeing a combination of problems:

1. Potentially a slightly screwy AVI file, maybe with some bad header information or some wacky intermediate frame data or something. Stuff that lets it render during playback, but makes editing it ... difficult.

2. XVID might not be totally kosher with Vista. This is more than likely. Much as the project has evolved, xvid is written entirely by pirates and hackers. Their code is somewhat notorious for working FLAWLESSLY on whatever system Koeppi is sitting in front of, and not so well on other systems. *cough* It's not entirely xvid's fault, though. Vista changes a ton of stuff, some of it quite unnecessary.

3. Vista is bossy. It internally assigns its own decoders (many of which simply aren't up to the task) a higher weight than they might otherwise get.

Your task with G-Spot is to figure out if the xvid decoder is even SEEING the file, or if someone else is nabbing it first! It's a great program because in addition to showing you file information like size, headers, framerate, and all the technical details... it will also show you the rendering path, both for DirectShow and raw, and then it will attempt to render the file a few different ways. You can see if any of the rendering paths use the wrong decoder this way. Last but not least, it has some built-in tools to list out all the codecs. I don't know if the author has gotten around to including the decoder weight changing bit, but there are other freewares which will do that nicely.

[VJ]

Didn't sound too retarded to me...

I'm personally blaming the files themselves: Super uses only its internal codecs (at least, when the "directshow" option is cleared), and can't read them for anything other than playback (fails after 10-15 minutes).
I suspect MediaCoder (which calls mencoder) also uses internal codecs, but perhaps better ones than those from Super.

I'll run G-spot, as I'm curious to see what it will report for the files (will keep you posted).


Jörg

[VJ]

G-spot reports no problems with either the file or with the decoders I have installed (it finds a suitable decoder for playback).

Perhaps the decoder need to read the file for reencoding differs from the one for playback?


Jörg

[Gurm]

G-spot reports no problems with either the file or with the decoders I have installed (it finds a suitable decoder for playback).

Perhaps the decoder need to read the file for reencoding differs from the one for playback?


Jörg

THAT really depends on the encoder. At this point you might want to take this problem over to the VideoHelp.com forums. Although they banned me (can't imagine WHY) they're really very good with this sort of thing.