Guys at nVIDIA really working hard!

[Buuri]

"So, today there are 2 newly born GPUs ready to replace GeForce (NV10): NV15 and NV11"

"...with 0.18 micron technology."

"any application optimized for GeForce256 will perfectly work on NV15 and NV11 based cards."

"...NV15 will dissipate twice as little power as GeForce256, and NV11 - 30% less power than NV15."

"NV15 chip like GeForce256 has four rendering pipelines, and NV11 - two rendering pipelines. In fact, NV11 is a NV15 cheaper version"

"NV15 and NV11 chips support the local graphics memory of the following size: 8, 16, 32, 48, 64, 96 and 128MB."

"The graphics cards manufacturers are going to receive the first NV15 and NV11 chips in the end of January already. In March we will see the first real graphics cards based on the new GPUs, and the mass sales will start in the second quarter."

GeForce 256 (120MHz) 480 mln pixels 240 mln pixels
NV15 (160MHz) 640 mln pixels 640 mln pixels
NV11 (160MHz) 320 mln pixels 320 mln pixels
Savage2000 (125MHz) 250 mln pixels 250 mln pixels
Voodoo5 5000 (2xVSA100, 166MHz) 664 mln pixels 332 mln pixels
Voodoo5 6000 (4xVSA100, 166MHz) 1328 mln pixels 664 mln pixels

In January already! This is not a flame bait, but do you think that Matrox has a chip ready this month?

_
B

[Sensei]

I also read in that same article that it will have DualHead support. Pretty cool.
http://www.ixbt-labs.com/video/nv15.shtml

The DualHead thing is toward the bottom...

Pete

[Himself]

Am I missing something? The specs sounded great to me, fantastic even. The next time I want to buy some specs those are the ones I want to get. (Keep in mind that's all that exists now, specs). Dual Head (depending on the card config), low power consumption finally, twice the multitexturing capability than the G256, DVD acceleration, not to mention T&L. No negatives so far other than the memory bandwidth limits, which make the card either very expensive using DDR 300 or bottlenecked.

I've never had a beef with the NVIDIA hardware per se, only the marketing department for lying about it's weaknesses (lack of real trilinear, multitexturing performance drops, 32 bit performance, poor AGP performance etc), and the drivers being total crap. If they ever learn how to write a good driver, and I'm still waiting for a company that knows how to do an excellent driver, they have tempted to buy from them again. Then again, where's the competition? I'm not going to pay an arm and a leg for it, and if something else is even close I'll go for that instead, based on past bad experiences with the company.

Seems like NVIDIA is the only company making new video cards these days (great marketing even if it sucks), where is the rest? ATi MAXX is about getting rid of old inventory. 3dfx is going after a different market possibly with super SLI configs, nothing too exciting there, playing catch up really. S3 is still learning how to write drivers and trying to cover up hardware limits. Matrox is always late with a good but not market dominating list of specs. In any case if you were ever to go NVIDIA this would be a good generation to try out, no extreme prototype factor as with the G256 cards, and maybe one or two games will appear for it during it's lifetime. But somebody else try one first.

My $02.

[Wombat]

Keep in mind that even the TNT2 failed to meet all of the announced specs for the original TNT chip.

[Sensei]

Before I got a G400 MAX, I had a TNT2 Ultra (I needed the dualhead). I never had a problem with Nvidia's drivers or anything and the support was always top notch. Now that the NV15 will have dualhead, maybe it's time to go back to Nvidia. Although, I will give Matrox a chance to counter it.

Pete

[rickn]

anyone who says Geforce has terrible image quality is on crack. As for dualhead, matrox did not create dual display, they simply put it onto one card.

[Wombat]

I've seen no reputable review that says the GeForce looks as good as or better than Matrox cards.

About dual-head. Ummm, what the hell is your point? I don't even know what you're trying to discredit.

[Storm]

Matrox's excellent image quality is only noticeable at high 2d resolutions, but other than the DualHead (which NVidia will have in the next card of course) this is the only arguable point for Matrox. I think if the Matrox people don't get themselves in gear, they'll be back as the best 2D graphics card manufacturer, but gamers will most likely use NVidia's new array of cards. You have to be either insane, rich or both to get the V6000 for gaming.

This is just my opionion, so don't flame me

Let's hope Matrox releases something mind-blowing soon.

[This message has been edited by Storm (edited 13 January 2000).]

[Mark F]

Marcatexture in action.

Mark F.

------------------
OH NO, my retractable cup holder swallowed a CD

[Gasoline]

The G400Max is a very good running card, as is the GeForce (I have both). IN MY OPINION, the Matrox has the Geforce beat on image quality. Not by much though. I really wish Matrox would give us a hint about their new Video Card for this year. At least to try and build up some anticipation in its loyal followers. Maybe Matrox needs to work on their marketing techniques a little bit.

[Wombat]

Respectfully, I couldn't disagree with you more. Matrox's marketing and PR has long been doing them more harm than good. An OpenGL ICD long after they broke multiple deadlines, the DVD add-on, digital out, huge problems with availability dates of the G400....and so forth.

Being quiet about future developments is the smartest move PR's made in a long time. That department was repeatedly kicking Matrox in its own ass, and it couldn't take it much more before before Matrox wouldn't be able to get up again.

[Elie]

Guys don't live in the past!
If Matrox delayed the ICD 2 years ago I'm pretty sure they had their reasons.

Let's stick to NOW, and NOW we have a great OpenGL driver to make our games run faster with excellent quality.
Going on about the Dual Head on the NV11/15..
I think Nvidia screwed up by saying that you need an external ramdac for the second monitor??? with G400 you don't need anything.

I wonder how Nvidia is gonna market that

Cheers,
Elie

[LAMFDTK]

"NOW we have a great OpenGL driver "

No we have a decent OGL driver and a Turbo "patch"

[paulcs]

I'm with Wombat here. Matroxusers appear to have longer memories than nVidia users. NVidia overstates the specs of an announced product, it causes some relatively minor stirrings when the board is released, the board is competitive or beats hand down whatever product 3dfx has out, and everybody is happy.

Matrox overstates a new product's capabilities, and Matroxusers act like spurned lovers. The OpenGL debacle was practically Wagnerian in its intensity and length. (I picture the whole lot of us in winged helmets and blonde braids, standing on top of a mountain, howling at the top of our lungs.)

Let's face it. In early press releases and marketing literature, Matrox did say the G400 would support AGP 4x transfers, although they rapidly changed their tune and began claiming AGP 4x compatibility. People still got upset, despite the fact the standard currently has few real world applications and extremely limited software and hardware support. Matrox impresses me as a fairly conservative company. I bet this stuff makes the executive staff cringe.

Better they keep their mouths shut until they actually know exactly what's going on with their new product. It seems whenever Matrox gets into trouble, their marketing department is always nearby, slingshot in hand.

I think Matrox is well-positioned to be competitive with nVidia. The G400, I think, is a better board than the TNT2 Ultra, hands down. The GeForce appears to be an nVidia interim release, and we'll see the real fruit of their labors in the Spring. It's hard to say exactly what Matrox will do. If they stick to their pattern, we'll see a response in the Summer.

Maybe Matrox has something up their sleeves. 3dfx appears to be screwing up royally, leaving a gap in the market. NVidia appears to be releasing boards with new specs every three months. (Who cares what ATI is doing? Mac-users maybe. ) Maybe Matrox will respond and we'll see something sooner. I would hope this "something" is competitive with the NV15 and not the GeForce, however.

Paul
paulcs@flashcom.net

[This message has been edited by paulcs (edited 14 January 2000).]

[CHHAS]

You can say a lot a bad thing about Nvidia, but all things considered they are the markets top graphics chips manufacturer.
The Geforce is the best 3D accelerator today, and even if they do have a problem with living up to their own initial specs, they have great driver support, and brings something new to the industry (T&L hardware).

My last card was a ATI Rage Fury, and I've never been so disappointed, the drivers sucked, and they still do.

3Dfx still needs to support 32 bit rendering and large textures.

S3 can't get their T&L to work.

Matrox are still king on image quality, but if they don't come forward with a T&L card, I cannot see how my next card can be anything but a Nvidia.

Now I have a G400 16 mb, and I'm happy with it, but why people tried to knock Nvidia is beyond me.

Anyway, just my 2 cents.