Some thoughts about next-gen video cards

[isochar]

Seems that 3dfx is already pre-ordering the V5 5500 AGP/PCI on its site. However, they also say that the card won't be delivered for another 2 months. =)

Here's the 3dfxgamers Newsgroup if you want to revel in the disappointment of 3dfx fans:
>=)
http://www.3dfxgamers.com/boards.asp?BOID=7&start=1

Nvidia seems to be delaying the NV15 for another few months as well: http://www.ixbt-labs.com/news.shtml#955823167

"the cards will be shipped in volume in the beginning of June" which means that we won't see them until July.

Wow, amazing how the G800's release date seems reasonable now. =) GO MATROX!!!

[paulcs]

Don't get your hopes up. If Matrox ever ships a product on time, the shock might kill me. Most certainly, the moon will turn blue and it will be snowing in Hell.

Paul
paulcs@flashcom.net

[Dyre]

And if its going to be late, we wont ever know... Matrox will have 3 shipments built and packaged and on 2 day delievery to reviewers and resellers. Then the y will announce the exsistance of the product the day it arrives at the re-sellers doors.

Of course after that they wont shut up about it!

BTW, who's hoping for the G450 in the next couple weeks? me me me!

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PIII 450 @ 504
generic BX motherboard
G400 MAX : )
GlobalWin VOS32!
Maxtor 13 gig UDMA 33
Maxtor 13 gig UDMA 66
Creative 36x CD-ROM
96 megs PC100 RAM
128 megs PC133 ECC RAM
NetGear 10/100
Soundblaster 32 AWE
Diamond SupraExpress 56k
Logitech Wireless Desktop (best $50 ive ever spent)
1 92mm Sunon Fan
4 80mm Sunon Fan's

[Technoid]

The NV15 will be released as soon as nvidias master Technichian finds his glasses (or was it his contact lenses?)

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INTEL PIII550 MSI 6163
G400Mill 32MB SGRAM + RRG
SBlive
256 MB RAM CAS2
43GB HDD Space!(Actual 40GB) (13+30 Quantum drives)
Pioneer 104S DVD 10x CD 40x SLOT IN
SONY CRX100E 4/2/24 CDRW

[Gurm]

Ahhhh. So 3dfx has delayed the V55006739948 (codenamed hyper-bitchin-spazmafastcellerator) again? The shock and horror!

Funny how the V4 never materialized. Who wants to bet that the V5 is yet another iteration of the V1 clocked up another hundred megahertz? Hmm?

And the NV15 was delayed? Most likely because they couldn't READ the onscreen display because it was so fuzzy. Thus they couldn't tell if it was working correctly or not.

- Gurm

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Listen up, you primitive screwheads! See this? This is my BOOMSTICK! Etc. etc.

[Mark F]

Actually he's wearing them. It's the VidCard out-put confusing him.

Mark F.

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OH NO, my retractable cup holder swallowed a DVD...
and burped out a movie

[Greebe]

Wasn't that what the doctor prescribed... 20/50 vision! LOL

[isochar]

Here's a preview of the V5 5500 AGP... http://www.beyond3d.com/previews/hardware/voodoo5_5500/

Looks like an overhyped card.

[paulcs]

It looks very large.

Paul
paulcs@flashcom.net

[isochar]

Speaking of the V5 6000, why does it need that power supply? Don't next-generation motherboards have an agp slot with more juice?

[Muad'Dib]

well, according to the masses, "size does matter," correct?

Dimitri

[Pace]

isochar, the AGP slot you are referring to is AGP Pro but is generally only available on workstation boards (i840) which are a tad expensive - several hundred notes over a BX/820 board so it would be cheaper getting an external power supply.

Also, I doubt that 3dfx would bring out a board that doesn't run on current boards (BX) - so the external PS fixes this.

On another note, the 5500 needs a 4-pin internal supply from your PC's supply and will consume upto 50W! This may cause problems for many people (those who want fast but not the cost of the 6K).

And another note: The FSAA on NVIDIA's cards have a performance hit of 50% - because they are doing two-sample supersampling, whereas V4/5 will do 4-sample and cut's performance to 25% - so what is the benefit of 3dfx supporting FSAA? I admit they have the fill rate to do it but is this really a feature of the chip - or as NVIDIA has shown can be enabled with a 'leaked' driver release.

Hmmm, 3dfx about to release a FSAA card and NVIDIA slip up and 'accidentally' release FSAA drivers and a NV15 prelim spec sheet!

And finally, I think I'd rather play a game at a crisp 1600x1200 than a blurred 800x600 - anyone else agree - what if you are trying to hit a single column of pixels viewable round a corner - would this be as visible on FSAA? I don't think so - what do you's think?

Paul.

[Himself]

I think you guys are being overly critical of things non Matrox.

[Corwin_Brute]

NVidia's FSAA uses supersampling : for example, if you want to render your frame at 800x600, it is internally rendered at 1600x1200 and then downsampled to 800x600. This last operation generates (I think) a large CPU overhead, is API dependant... That's why, although it has been a marketing feature for years, nobody was crazy enough to actually use it.

On the other hand, 3DFx's FSAA uses multisampling, that is to say different versions of the same frames which are combined via the T-Buffer. The quality is better, the image is less blurred, and the performance hit is less (especially CPU-wise). And it is API-independant, which sure is nice...

On this FSAA thing, NVidia obviously released these "leaked" drivers to take advantage of 3DFx's hype...

I'm sure the G800 will have some kind of FSAA (probably supersample), because it is a must-have feature for image quality.

About high resolution vs. FSAA, it depends. - FSAA cures many more artifacts that jaggies (mainly texturing gap and pixel popping)
- not anybody has a 21" monitor for 1600x1200 gaming
- the blur effect can be a problem, it depends on the game you are playing

On the overall, the Voodoo 5 looks like a very impressive piece of hardware, for a gamer at least. I'd rather go with it than with a GeFarce, and I'd even more go with a G800 with quadri-head ;-)


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Corwin the Brute

[isochar]

>On the overall, the Voodoo 5 looks like a >very impressive piece of hardware, for a >gamer at least. I'd rather go with it than >with a GeFarce, and I'd even more go with a >G800 with quadri-head ;-)

I'm surprised you'd say that. The V5 performance w/o FSAA is on par with the GeForce, and with better drivers it may be slightly higher. Speaking of drivers, 3dfx has stated that Win2k support will not be in the box and will come 2 months after the V5 release. Not to mention all the driver problems....

In comparison the "GeFarce" 2 will be doing 30% better than its predecessor. (As the leaked info showed) It'll come with Win2k support, AND drivers that set the standard for the industry.

The G800 is another story, hopefully Matrox will be thinking competitively and include T&L along with FSAA as options. As well as some other features, including the ones we know and love on our G400MAXs. Throw in a fill rate and drivers to match that put a GeForce2 to shame. We've got a winner on our hands?

Or we may just get another G200 fiasco =)