Someone from Matrox please help...

[Haig]

Hi Kai,

our on-line-store policy is refunds within 30 days with no questions asked.

Haig

[Himself]

TweakUtil.exe? First I've heard of it.

[Haig]

It's a simple util to force our cards to 1x rather than having our clients go thru the registry.

Haig

[This message has been edited by Haig (edited 21 October 1999).]

[Ozymandis]

I just wanted to say that I had to return my first G400max because it had heat trouble and it took only a week to get a new one. From what I have heard Matrox customer service and tech support has improved 100%.

[Ozymandis]

I just wanted to say that I had to return my first G400max because it had heat trouble and it took only a week to get a new one. From what I have heard Matrox customer service and tech support has improved 100%.

[Himself]

I was just wondering why you guys didn't just flesh out the overclocking program. Seemed rather odd for there to be a separate utility. Any news on a new version of the overclocking thing with more options than VSync?

I caught the first version, btw, guess that's the advantage of using tech support, getting the latest information on utils.

[Haig]

For reasons I can't say, the O/Cer has to stay in the dev rel section. This way, no one else can get upset since it's their to help out the developers.

It wouldn't be possible for us to include the 1x force in the same util and email it out to everyone.

Right now, this is the only option there is on it. We will add more options if we need but don't know on which util we will add it to.

"btw, guess that's the advantage of using tech support, getting the latest information on utils."

You can get more info than this. You just have to ask the right questions

Haig

[This message has been edited by Haig (edited 21 October 1999).]

[Wombat]

Madman,
If you've already RMA'ed a card, and the fault was user error, what makes you think you're not up to it again? The tech support is really trying to help, but you're being pretty stubborn about it.
If I were in your (hardware) situation, I'd move the Live! to IRQ 9 (in case it likes being level-sensitive), and upgrade its drivers as well.

-Wombat

[Madman]

First of all, thanks guys for all the feedbacks, I really appreciated.

Second, I heard something about that the first batch of G400 Maxs are not AGP 4x but only 2x. You can tell by looking at the AGP connectors and there are two extension instead of one. Man I hope my card is 4x compliant....

Lastly, does anyone want to take my question as to why would people want to run stuff on AGP 1x? Is it slower? And Haig, thanks for the info. I guess I waited too long.

Madman

[Kruzin]

Short answers (long answers are here in the forums...you just gotta search em out):

-All G400s are 4x compliant, in that they will fit in a 4x slot, and autoswitch to the proper voltage. However, all current G400s will run at a maximum 2x x-fer rate. 4x compliance, and 4x transfers are two different things.

-You will see no real difference running in 1x over 2x in most real life apps and games. Software is only now starting to use AGP transfers, and still not doing it that much. The only place you are likely to see a difference is in synthetic benchmarks like 3dMark99max that tests with extremely large textures. Then there is the WAY the G400 uses AGP...DiME mode vs DMA mode (which all other cards do) 1x DiME is nearly as efficient as 2x DMA. So, don't fret about running in 1x. You will not see the difference.

OK...not as short as I first intended

[Madman]

Okay Kruzin,

So you're basically saying that if you bought a brand new car with a dent or a chip, it doesn't really matter because you can't really notice it. Is that right? Well, it matters to me because I bought the card knowing that it will run in AGP 2x. I don't like to sacrafice perfomance. Too bad on the box of the card it doesn't say "AGP 2X Works if you're lucky but 1X is recommend" or "only works correctly if bus mastering is disabled". It seems to me that I'm forced to keep something that is faulty. What is this world coming to? People just don't have the decency to have a honest business anymore.

Madman

[Kruzin]

Geez, dude. Take a pill.

"So you're basically saying that if you bought a brand new car with a dent or a chip, it doesn't really matter because you can't really notice it. Is that right?"

No that's not right. Where did I say a damn thing about you buying a damaged car? I'm talking about computer hardware, and the reality of how it operates, specifically about the difference in 1x and 2x AGP as it pertains to real life performance. You did ask the question "Is it slower?". All I did was answer you.

There are any number of reasons people can't get 2x stable on their systems, and not all (or even 5%) of them are "faulty" video cards. It's almost always some other component in the system. The DiME AGP implimentation is very touchy to timings and bus noise. Most people who can't run 2x find it's because of their motherboard. Some even find something simple like shifting RAM from one slot to another on certain mobos makes a difference. Most people (myself included) can run 2x with no problem. All I said was that if you can't run in 2x stabley(for whatever reason), you would not see a noticable difference in performance. Thats a reality. Run 3dmark or q2 benchmarks or whatever you want. You'll see I'm right.

So quit acting like such a prick. You ask for opinions, and when you don't like what you hear, you flake out. Take a prozac. I know I won't waste any more my time offering my help or opinions to you as long as your head is shoved up your ass.

[Gurm]

Madman:

Here's some advice and some info. Take it or leave it, I'm not likely to post again in this thread, it's gotten waaaaay out of hand and you're acting... well... anyway:

1. Kruzin's AGP explanation was pretty much right on, and it's NOT like buying a car with a dent. It's like buying a car with an engine that can make the car go 200Mph, but tires that are only rated for 85. You want the car to go faster? Buy better tires. You want AGP 2x? Buy a brand-name BX Intel motherboard. In the meantime cope.

2. I looked at your IRQ list. Some problems:

3 Com4

It this a modem? I can only presume yes because I didn't see a NIC on your list anywhere. If not, kill this off... or use Com1 on IRQ4. Even if it IS a modem, use Com1 or 3 on IRQ4.

4 SB Live Value

This is bad. The Live should be up in a higher IRQ. 10 is good. And then it needs IRQ 5 for Sound Blaster 16 emulation. Odds on says it's bumping the two devices on 5 whenever you start up Windows. Icky! Plus, there's no IRQ Holder for PCI Steering! That isn't good at all. Move this Live! It is most certainly causing problems for you.

5 Adaptec 2940UW SCSI
5 Intel 82371AB/EB PCI to USB UHC
5 PCI Steering

Ok, this is fine, but shouldn't be on IRQ5. IRQ5 is for your Sound Blaster 16 emulation. Period.

9 Free

Ok, put the Live! here. Then put the stuff on IRQ 5 into IRQ 4.

Try this stuff out and see what happens. Ok?

- Gurm

------------------
G. U. R. M. It's not hard to spell, is it? Then don't screw it up!
The word "Gurm" is in no way Copyright 1999 Jorden van der Elst.

[Himself]

For reasons I can't say, the O/Cer has to stay in the dev rel section. This way, no one else can get upset since it's their to help out the developers.

It wouldn't be possible for us to include the 1x force in the same util and email it out to everyone.

Ok, I understand that bit, you don't want to compound problems in the tech support arena by giving folks too many options. That answers one aspect of my question.

So, I am seeing it like this:

1. There will never be an official tweak panel included with the drivers, it will always be something hidden in the developer section. Doesn't bother me, Creative's overclocking util for the TNT 1 wasn't bundled with the drivers either. NVIDIA uses a registry flag to hide the functionality in the reference drivers.

It seems obvious to me that more than one entry was intended for the overclocking util, at least by the programmer, I mean why use a listview if you are only going to use a handful of options? Why have a column denoting category? Seems more like a trailer for things to come.

2. Given that it will only be in the developer section, in an you're on your own, we will disavow any knowledge kind of way, will the utility get more tweak options?

(All I would need is a text file documenting the registry entries available (storage, data format, and description) and I could do up my own util. I can look at hex dumps all day long but it won't tell me the type of registry entry being used or what data they are expecting. Most of the types of entries implied in the hex dump relating to BES (whatever that is), dual head, monitors etc, need not be documented, just the simple ones like antialias, use3dnow, Acceleration2D, BusMastering2D, BumpMulti, etc)

Right now, this is the only option there is on it. We will add more options if we need but don't know on which util we will add it to.

Well, with tech support and "need" that's a separate thing, do whatever makes sense.

Frankly, IMO, if you didn't store everything all over the place in arbitrary locations you could just send along a reg file or inf file and tell the user to click on that instead of an exe. I'd be interested in a rational for why things are stored as they are.

"btw, guess that's the advantage of using tech support, getting the latest information on utils."

You can get more info than this. You just have to ask the right questions

Too bad this is just text, otherwise we could play charades.

[Haig]

"Ok, I understand that bit, you don't want to compound problems in the tech support arena by giving folks too many options. That answers one aspect of my question."

Nope. I wasn't referring to end users being upset at Matrox.

"Frankly, IMO, if you didn't store everything all over the place in arbitrary locations you could just send along a reg file or inf file and tell the user to click on that instead of an exe. I'd be interested in a rational for why things are stored as they are."

The reason why some of it is stored where they are is because we have to comply with MS.

Haig