Hmmm, I know you're testing, but...

[Ant]

I have a cable modem, plenty of bandwidth, sites load in a flash except for a couple of sites that I visit, totally unrelated on different networks, these sites both load horrendously slowly taking up to a minute or more to load, one of them is the BBC site. So obviously it's the sites and their servers that are to blame isn't it?

No it's not, if I use my 56K dial up through the same ISP I have my cable modem with those same two sites load in a matter of seconds.

[Ees]

Just a related thought: for financial (bandwidth) reasons, many ISP nowadays use transparant proxies. So you may be going through a proxy, even if think you're not.

These transparant proxies are generally pretty reliable, except when they're not.

Martin

[The PIT]

Thats bit like saying it runs until it breaks down.
I haven't seen the problem either at work or at home lately but then I might not have been around when it was present.
The other solution is to pay Ant a fee so he can host his own site without any banners etc. I can't see anyone going for that somehow.
So it's put up with some crummy slow ads at times.

[Jorden]

I did a tracert to the mainpage of the forums and 100 pings. At the time I had no problems with the forums, but thought I'd test it.
No other programs open using the internet. Almost sounds like a benchmark

But here's the results. Tracert to forums.murc.ws

Tracing route to forums.murc.ws [216.162.101.9]
over a maximum of 30 hops:

1 124 ms 109 ms 206 ms uds-wxs-asd-cr03.wxs.nl [195.121.0.110]
2 426 ms 467 ms 302 ms iawxs5.wxs.nl [195.121.0.105]
3 110 ms 124 ms 96 ms iawxs7-l3.wxs.nl [195.121.0.226]
4 110 ms 110 ms 124 ms POS9-2.hsa1.ams1.level3.net [212.72.47.5]
5 110 ms 110 ms 110 ms loopback0.mp1.ams1.l3.net [212.113.2.17]
6 179 ms 178 ms 179 ms 212.187.128.173
7 193 ms 260 ms 248 ms 212.187.128.138
8 1305 ms 1112 ms 851 ms pos8-0.core2.NewYork1.level3.net [209.247.10.38]
9 714 ms 398 ms 384 ms 209.244.160.190
10 865 ms 948 ms 837 ms acr1-loopback.Chicagochd.cw.net [208.172.2.61]
11 1085 ms 1030 ms 1112 ms aar1-loopback.Chicagochd.cw.net [208.172.2.2]
12 1222 ms 1290 ms 1209 ms DS3-NETWORKUSA.Chicagochd.cw.net [208.172.7.18]
13 645 ms 330 ms 233 ms www.valuenet.net [216.162.101.9]

Trace complete.

Pinging:
ping froums.matroxusers.com -n 100

Pinging forums.murc.ws [216.162.101.9] with 32 bytes of data:

Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=344ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=1139ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=220ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=344ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=645ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=659ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=782ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=975ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=907ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=673ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=220ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=192ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=398ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=220ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=481ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=206ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=206ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=220ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=480ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=343ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=248ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=206ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=220ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=206ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=206ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=193ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=220ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=288ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=412ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=220ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=220ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=206ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=206ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=206ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=206ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=206ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=219ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=206ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=288ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=632ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=371ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=206ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=206ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=206ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=206ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=219ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=247ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=206ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=275ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=399ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=219ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=206ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=645ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=686ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=989ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=1030ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=521ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=219ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=206ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=440ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=329ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=302ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=233ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=344ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=219ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=206ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=206ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=206ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=302ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=206ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=549ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=494ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=275ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=220ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=220ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=206ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=219ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=206ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=220ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=206ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=206ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=206ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=234ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=206ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=206ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=192ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=206ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=206ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=205ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=220ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=247ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=219ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=288ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=398ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=398ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=206ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=220ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=206ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=192ms TTL=243
Reply from 216.162.101.9: bytes=32 time=193ms TTL=243

Ping statistics for 216.162.101.9:
Packets: Sent = 100, Received = 100, Lost = 0 (0% loss),
Approximate round trip times in milli-seconds:
Minimum = 192ms, Maximum = 1139ms, Average = 323ms
<hr>
Ant, I don't hold a grudge against you or the forums or the ad-server or whatever. I sure don't think you're lying!! It was just an observation I made, and at that time dZeus and I were talking on ICQ, so we could test.

Next time it happens I'll sure use tracert and ping again, as it's one of the first things I do at Sony's as well. I have to admit I didn't think about doing that in the at home situation, sorry for that.

And a next time it happens I'll post it in Site Feedback. Complete with pings & tracert's.

Jord.

[This message has been edited by Jorden (edited 01 February 2001).]

[Pace]

1 <10 ms <10 ms <10 ms PACE3000 [192.168.0.1]
2 * * * Request timed out.
3 1162 ms 1392 ms 2133 ms edi-dam1-a-fa10.inet.ntl.com [62.253.1.197]
4 150 ms 170 ms 170 ms edi-core-a-pos100.inet.ntl.com [62.253.0.129]
5 141 ms 180 ms 150 ms lng-bb-a-atm100-802.inet.ntl.com [62.253.187.58]

6 140 ms 291 ms 150 ms lng-bb-b-ge-130-0.inet.ntl.com [62.253.188.141]

7 140 ms 230 ms 161 ms above-ntl-2.lhr.above.net [208.185.188.41]
8 270 ms 241 ms 260 ms lga1-lhr1-stm4.lga1.above.net [208.184.231.21]
9 250 ms 230 ms 661 ms core1-core4-oc48.lga1.above.net [216.200.127.194
]
10 721 ms 261 ms 240 ms core5-core1-oc48.lga1.above.net [216.200.127.190
]
11 881 ms 290 ms 291 ms lax1-lga1-oc12.lax1.above.net [208.185.156.117]

12 290 ms 271 ms 290 ms qwest-above-oc3.lax.above.net [208.184.102.146]

13 571 ms 291 ms 290 ms lax-core-01.inet.qwest.net [205.171.19.37]
14 1072 ms 360 ms 461 ms lax-edge-08.inet.qwest.net [205.171.19.142]
15 * * * Request timed out.
16 * * * Request timed out.
17 * * * Request timed out.
18 * * * Request timed out.
19 * * * Request timed out.
20 * * * Request timed out.
21 * * * Request timed out.
22 * * * Request timed out.
23 * * * Request timed out.
24 * * * Request timed out.
25 * * * Request timed out.
26 * * * Request timed out.
27 * * * Request timed out.
28 * * * Request timed out.
29 * * * Request timed out.
30 * * * Request timed out.

or ?

Suppose you've gotta laugh - coz I never have problems loading the site (cue major headaches for Paul... )

Paul.

[Ant]

Jorden you have a major problem en route right here:

8 1305 ms 1112 ms 851 ms pos8-0.core2.NewYork1.level3.net [209.247.10.38]

the important part being 1305ms, I'd report that to your ISP if it continues.

[Ant]

<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Jorden:
Ant, I don't hold a grudge against you or the forums or the ad-server or whatever. I sure don't think you're lying!! It was just an observation I made, and at that time dZeus and I were talking on ICQ, so we could test.
</font>

I have no problem with people reporting problems whether they in fact lie with the server or not. What annoys me is that you made a gross assumption, first in that the problem was with the server and second that it was to do with the site redesign and you posted it in here as a rant.

If I remember correctly in the past you've had problems that turned out to be not with the servers but with your ISP or were down to your use of Netscape.

Hey it's a rant so I get to rant back

[dZeus]

well I admit it was very stupid of me(/us) that we didn't do a trace when I couldn't reach the forums properly that morning. It's the first thing I'll do next time, and untill then it could have been caused by just about anything, as you already said.

here's a trace, for future reference if I get troubles
traceroute to forums.murc.ws (216.162.101.9), 30 hops max, 38 byte packets
1 campus.routing.utwente.nl (130.89.254.1) 0.754 ms 0.499 ms 0.473 ms
2 BR2.Enschede.surf.net (145.41.161.13) 1.118 ms 0.513 ms 0.507 ms
3 BR7.Amsterdam.surf.net (145.41.7.169) 4.009 ms 4.114 ms 3.868 ms
4 BR2.NewYork.surf.net (145.41.0.90) 80.654 ms 80.749 ms 80.719 ms
5 if-1-11.core1.NewYork.Teleglobe.net (207.45.196.129) 80.511 ms 80.567 ms 80.449 ms
6 if-10-0.bb8.NewYork.Teleglobe.net (207.45.223.110) 80.844 ms 80.357 ms 80.623 ms
7 ix-8-0-1.bb8.NewYork.Teleglobe.net (207.45.198.74) 81.124 ms 80.967 ms 81.412 ms
8 0.at-6-1-0.XL1.NYC9.ALTER.NET (152.63.22.226) 81.058 ms 81.014 ms 81.448 ms
9 0.so-7-0-0.XR1.NYC9.ALTER.NET (152.63.23.138) 81.686 ms 81.264 ms 81.251 ms
10 0.so-3-0-0.TR1.NYC9.ALTER.NET (152.63.22.98) 81.425 ms 81.024 ms 81.125 ms
11 125.at-5-0-0.TR1.STL3.ALTER.NET (152.63.6.62) 108.208 ms 108.287 ms 107.943 ms
12 289.at-1-0-0.XR1.STL3.ALTER.NET (152.63.90.21) 109.176 ms 109.315 ms 109.207 ms
13 185.ATM6-0.GW5.STL3.ALTER.NET (152.63.67.161) 110.872 ms 110.610 ms 109.722 ms
14 valuenet-gw.customer.alter.net (157.130.108.2) 109.630 ms 109.875 ms 109.102 ms
15 www.valuenet.net (216.162.101.9) 121.469 ms 109.624 ms 109.321 ms

[dZeus]

and what's this?

[root@cal022054 /home/httpd/html/misc/images]# ping www.murc.ws
PING www.murc.ws (216.240.130.227) from 130.89.228.112 : 56(84) bytes of data.
From wvision-la-oc3-gsr1.webvision.com (63.149.192.126): Packet filtered
From wvision-la-oc3-gsr1.webvision.com (63.149.192.126): Packet filtered
From wvision-la-oc3-gsr1.webvision.com (63.149.192.126): Packet filtered

they block icmp packets? to stop DDOS attacks or something?

[Argen]

Yep, unfortunately it's nothing Ant and me can do about. I had the exact problem with my last project, www.gamerslounge.com. The ad banners caused the whole loading process to hang, but I got the flames because users thought it was a bug with the layout.

------------------
- Argen
kelvin@gagames.com

Graphics Designer @ matroxusers.com