Should humans be allowed to modify genes of offspring?

[pacguy]

Would they really be indentical?
I figure that scientist would include a fault on purpose for clone ID and to disable it should it ever go bad(like killing and such).

[Gurm]

I figure that PacGuy has been watching Arnold Schwarzzeknuckle movies lately, hmm?

- Gurm

[dave m]

Paddy, I'm an identical twin, superficially we look very, very similar, but we don't have identical fingerprints. Hope that clears that one up at least.

Dave

[Gurm]

Didn't I just say that identical DNA does not make for identical fingerprints?

- Gurm

[dave m]

Yes you did. Paddy then asked a question as to whether identical twins had different finger prints- he thought probably not, I was answering him and also backing you up.

Dave

[KRSESQ]

Dave:

I recall reading once that identical twins sometimes have mirrored fingerprints. How do yours and your brother's compare in this regard?

Kevin

[dave m]

I know I have loops on some fingers and whorls on others and the pattern doesn't match his but I never considered mirror images before. I'll see if I can find out.

Dave

[cjolley]

By individual of course, I meant a completely separate person

If someone took a tissue sample from me and cloned me in
England not only would I not have a right to his organs
the clone would not even be an American citizen.

Persons who resulted from a cloning would still be persons.

One can assume that for the forseeable future the only way to
bring a clone to term would be through implantation. He or She
would have a mother just like everyone else.

All the moral handwringing about cloning is stupid. Once an actual
child exists it has the same rights as everyone else. No court
will ever rule otherwise.

chuck

[pacguy]

Arnold Schwarzzeknuckle, wha...

don't want to over react but what if someone screws up.,
it could happen, it will happen. thats just if they clone you, what if they improve the clone? what if the clone was psychotic did want to take over your life? some scary thoughts.

[cjolley]

Originally posted by pacguy
Arnold Schwarzzeknuckle, wha...

don't want to over react but what if someone screws up.,
it could happen, it will happen. thats just if they clone you, what if they improve the clone? what if the clone was psychotic did want to take over your life? some scary thoughts.

What if anybody was psychotic and wanted to take over your life? Why would that be less scary?
Chuck

[pacguy]

I admit, you've got me there.

[Paddy]

Do you not think that selective breeding is genetic manipulation?

Scientists have grown strawberries that are more resilient against the cold by splicing genes from many different plants. This works to a very high degree of accuracy.

Farmers on the other hand do the same process but with much less precision.

I am using this example to show that the process of evolving characteristics is natural. Science just allows us to do this under more controlled conditions, albeit right or wrong.

Wombat: I know that the principles can be applied to splicing genes from different organisms. I was just using a basic example.

For the those who voted that this is against God's will, How about mutating other organisms for medical purposes, such as in human insulin production?

Dave: Thanks for that! Who can explain their fingerprints are not identical?

[Greebe]

How about mutating other organisms for medical purposes, such as in human insulin production?

Show me one person that has problems with either synthetic or mutated Insulin and you will start to see the point the problem with your logic. Genetically altered corn... oh my it's so wonderful it's banned in many countries... and I've had it... messes up my digestion big time

Are you a strawberry... nope... have you ever have a natural wild strawberry?... How about today's tomatoes, lest forget the insane prices thay cost... but they taste like SHIT 9 times out of 10. Grow your own, in REAL fertilizer and see how they come out. Sure cross breeding plants and some animals do have benifits, but to what end do we rely on such methods? Bovine Growth Hormone has seriously affected how are children mature today... and many are against it.
The biggest reason why most of this is going on is to reduce loss, reduce production costs and to produce more and more and more than was once naturally possible. Why are we so blasted concerned about production? Simple, we as a race are destroying the planet at a faster rate than anything other creature in the history of the planet, not to forget the population explosion of our race! And there is where you arguement lies, how are we gonna feed all these people... is Solient Green gonna save us from starvation??? Extending the natural lifespan many many years beyond our productive years... when we care less and less about helping our elders... this is needless, I could go on and on and on... but what's the point when our science junkies well solve that too (NOT).

[pacguy]

Originally posted by Greebe

Solient Green

the other cloned meat

[dave m]

The Science Junkie speaks

OK, I'd better show my colours here. I am a molecular biologist ..

and I am dead against cloning humans.

Paddy: re fingerprints:
My brother and I got the same skin cells, no-one told them in which direction to grow, they do their own thing, just like branches on a tree, completely random. Take a skin biopsy, grow the cells on a tissue culture plate, you get some interesting whirls, curls, loops and patterns, never the same thing twice, they are not programmed to grow in a particular direction, just to cover. Entropy works in biology too. Once a pattern is there, they continue to follow it.

Genes are the original template, not the end result and that is what is scary about cloning.

Give the same house plan to 3 different developers and see if you get an identical house, I doubt it.

Identical twins are never identical, trust me. My brother and me started with the same gene plan, 40 odd years later, he needs glasses, I don't. I'm a shoe size larger. We both have the same high blood pressure (inherited from mum) but he's type 2 diabetic and I'm not. Probably a bit of life style in there

Every time nature copies a piece of DNA it makes mistakes, there is a lot of quality control in place to correct these mistakes, it doesn't always work, mistakes will always be made.

Dolly was an example of a clone that worked...

Who looks after the ones that don't quite work?

That's why I'm against cloning.

Dave