Found this Interesting Opinion

[Greebe]

When in trouble I just fart and the whole room is taken out

[KvHagedorn]

hehe

[Wombat]

The problem is children of law abiding citizens having access to their parents' guns (columbine?)

No, not Columbine. That was a longshot guess, and you missed. They got their weapons from some other teenagers. And they made their own pipebombs. Their parents were doing a pretty shitty job though, not realizing any of this.

You are saying that behaviors are always instinctual and never learned.

No, I'm saying that it's not video games that suddenly make a person decide that murder is okay. These people wouldn't live happy, healthy lives if it weren't for these evil media outlets - they would have eventually gone off.

[az]

Joel: It is arguably harder to kill 19 people with your bare fists or even with a baseball bat and no one is able to stop you than with a gun. This guy did AFAIK even shoot two people through a locked door - try this with your hand to hand weapon of choice!

Wombat: I did put a question mark in there, to indicate that I wasn't sure it was columbine I know that this happened somewhere, and I THOUGHT it was columbine. So it was not, but I remember having read and heard once about an incident where a child killed someone with his father's unsecured gun (dunno though if it was in the US, might have also been in Germany, Austria, or Switzerland) - this again is of course not only a problem of gun restrictment laws, but also of parents not being able to raise their children or even follow some basic safety measures, which is, I agree, an even bigger problem than gun restriction laws, but also one not so easily taken care of.

AZ

[Gurm]

Guns don't kill people...
...
...
I DO

- Gurm

[dZeus]

Guns don't kill people, people kill people...

sure they do, but what's your point?
Take 2 loonies, one with a gun, one without access to a gun. Guess which one is more likely to kill someone.

[Gurm]

I'll take that guess - it really depends on how loony they are.

Honestly, guns don't make people more likely to kill.

More people die each year from knife wounds than gunshots.

- Gurm

[RichL]

Originally posted by several people
Guns don't kill people. People kill peple.

I hear this argument every time I pass a gun control thread raging out of control in a forum somewhere.

True, guns dont kill people in the same manner a spade doesnt dig a hole on its own.

But a gun makes it a hell of a lot easier to kill someone than if you had to use your bare hands, a bat or even a knife.

EDIT : D'Oh! I really ought to read others comments more fully. I've just repeated about 3 other peoples words.

[Wombat]

Yes, guns are a way to amplify damage. But there also a couple hundred things in your home that could serve the same purpose. You have enough chemicals under your kitchen sink to poison food, create poison gas, or rather nasty explosions with relative ease. Are you going to ban bleach, too?

"I don't have a gun" does NOT AT ALL translate to "I have to resort to my fists.""

[dZeus]

sure, if people plan to kill someone, there are too many possible ways to accomplish that, to prevent anything/much at all by 'outlawing guns completely'.

But in a case of a loon who can lose control of himself, imho, he/she is much more dangerous when carrying a gun then when not. I believe that a lot of murders happen from 'impulse'. And I do believe that at the times an 'impulse'-murder happens, the access to a gun at that moment a large influence have on the possible damage to others.

[edit to clearify my point]

[Joel]

It is arguably harder to kill 19 people with your bare fists or even with a baseball bat and no one is able to stop you than with a gun.

I don't disagree with you but then again if some of the teachers or even an armed sercurity guard, who have been trained in the proper use of firearms and were carrying legally obtained sidearms had of been available then more than likely less people would have been killed also. And even if the kids did get the guns from their law abiding parents they still gained them illegally. And if they weren't able to steal them from their parents then they would have gotten them by other means. This was not a spur of the moment thing. They had been planning this for weeks before hand.

Remember one thing. Criminals love gun control. It make their job easier. Actually anything that suppresses a law abiding citizen's ability to defend themselves makes a criminal's job easier.

911 - Government sponsored dail-a-prayer.

Joel

[az]

Sure if the kids got the firearms from their parents who own them legally they'd have gotten them illegally, but if the parents wouldn't have had firearms, it would be much harder for the kids to just sneak into the cellar and "borrow" them, wouldn't it?

What if the teacher, who has a loaded firearm to protect himself and his pupils, got attacked from the back and forced to hand out his gun (or is killed and his gun taken, if he didn't hand it out), we have someone dangerous with a firearm running around - but if there are no firearms in reach, the subject would have to resort back to a knife, his fists, a chair, etc - all, while possibly dangerous, much less so than any firearm.

And yes, I think many of the people ticking out and killing other people in a rage wouldn't go through the hassle of "organizing" weapons on the black market - like they do not mix explosives or poisons from cleaning products they find in their house (except those few REALLY dangerous people, which of course can't be stopped by gun control laws).

Like I said before, violence is much of a society problem, BUT the handling of guns is of course part of that society - if guns are a normal part of everyday life, people will not treat them with due respect (for lack of a better formulation). You cannot deny the fact that guns and violence are tied together, the PURPOSE of guns is to inflict violence (be it to a deer, human, or paper target) - and the more natural violence is in a society, the more normal it will appear to kids (and misguided adults). In this light, restricting access to brutal videos, computer games, even books makes perfect sense, and some REALLY heavy content should be banned altogether...

AZ

[Wombat]

(except those few REALLY dangerous people, which of course can't be stopped by gun control laws).

That's who we're talking about, silly. You think these were just regular people having a bad day?

[az]

To some degree, yes.

AZ

[Marshmallowman]

look at countries that have always had good gun control, where the number of guns in circulation never go to high. Gun controls works for them.
But in countries with a tradition of gun ownership gun control will take years(decades maybe) to have any kind of effect, you have to get the guns out of circulation. Initially you will just be unarmimg the innocent, but eventually the criminals/ insane will find it a lot harder to find weapons.

in Australia a large percentage of the gun related deaths have been accidentaly, children finding there parents weapons.

I think less people are killed each year by guns since we introduced stronger gun laws, but there certainly has been an increase in criminal shootings(especially of police)

Its a pity the weapons industry is flourishing and always will flourish, that just the nature of people in general
But I do think less guns in general will help (especially automatic weapons).