Do you believe in ESP?

[Dogbert]

KvHagedorn, this is called empathy.

[Evildead666]

I follow the thought, that if something happens, it was meant to happen.
I have spent a good part of my life trying to do things, and i found out that things happen anyway, for good or bad, but you just don't have to rush it. If it is meant to happen, it will.
I don't think there is anything you can do about it.
You are born with some sort of ambition, deep down, which guides you most of your life, in the right direction.
I have no idea what it is, but i am more and more sure of it.
Fate/preordained.....shit happens.
People have long claimed that htey can see the future.
What if they really can? I don't think they will be able to change anything, since what they are seeing has already happened, albeit in the future.
But the fact remains, that if everything is preordained, then the future is the future, and some sensitive people can foresee what will happen.

The other factor is, what if there are parallel universes?
Is the clairvoyant seeing our future or another future?

[cjolley]

I knew you guys were going to say that stuff....
chuck

[KvHagedorn]

I don't know if everything is really preordained or not.. if people "forsee" things, perhaps it is a challenge to break free of the way things are headed.

[Byock]

Yeah, I have seen stranger things. who knows? But I think it is possible.

[Liquid_Memory]

Matthew 17:20

And Jesus said unto them, Because of your unbelief: for verily I say unto you, If ye have faith as a grain of mustard seed, ye shall say unto this mountain, Remove hence to yonder place; and it shall remove; and nothing shall be impossible unto you.

[Drizzt]

Liquid_Memory, are you sure that the Matthew use "yonder", "ye" and so on? ^^;;

[Liquid_Memory]

Your missing the point Drizzt, what I was getting at, is that if you have the faith of a mustard seed, you shall move mountains.

So anything is possible.

[Drizzt]

LM, sorry for that, but honestly I has missed the point for I couldn't understand what you wrote

However, I know everything is possible. I see it every day, you know?
And it's not always a good seeing...

[Liquid_Memory]

Sorry, I understand. The original King James Version of the bible is littered with those. But it is the closet translation to the original dead sea scrolls.

Yonder - Being at an indicated distance, usually within sight.
Ye - You.

[Gurm]

Do I believe in forces beyond our current understanding of the universe? Yep, sure do.

Do I believe in "ESP"? Nope.

I'm with Randi on this one.

The JREF (James Randi Education Foundation, http://www.randi.org) has offered a MILLION DOLLARS, in CASH, to anyone who can demonstrate ANY KIND OF PARANORMAL ABILITY.

Anything.

If ESP were real, someone would have cashed in on this. As it is, the prize has been outstanding for years now, and nobody has cashed in on it. Invitations have been extended to John Edward (he refused), Sylvia Browne (she accepted but has never called them back), and other famous "psychics".

As for John Edward... he's a cold reader. A VERY VERY skilled cold reader. Perhaps the best cold reader the world has EVER seen. But he has ZERO paranormal ability. None. Zip. Nada. He uses standard techniques of cold readers, his shows are carefully edited to make it seem that he isn't guessing, and impartial tests have shown that he's wrong a lot of the time. Oops. You can even catch him contradicting himself if you watch closely enough. Yikes!

- Gurm

[KvHagedorn]

Originally posted by Liquid_Memory
Matthew 17:20

And Jesus said unto them, Because of your unbelief: for verily I say unto you, If ye have faith as a grain of mustard seed, ye shall say unto this mountain, Remove hence to yonder place; and it shall remove; and nothing shall be impossible unto you.

One of my favorites

I guess no one has ever had true faith then.. thankfully for the geography.

[Gurm]

KvH,

Yeah pretty much. I mean, the people that KNEW Jesus personally couldn't muster up enough faith to join him walking on the water, so...

- Gurm

[Drizzt]

Originally posted by Gurm
Do I believe in forces beyond our current understanding of the universe? Yep, sure do.

Do I believe in "ESP"? Nope.

I'm with Randi on this one.

The JREF (James Randi Education Foundation, http://www.randi.org) has offered a MILLION DOLLARS, in CASH, to anyone who can demonstrate ANY KIND OF PARANORMAL ABILITY.

- Gurm

Gurm, from my real life experience I can assure that the problem here is NOT that ESP cannot be demonstrated, but that we have a wrong conception of what an ESPER can and can't do.



Basically a normal ESPER is a receiver, if no one transmit...well, the ESPER is useless.

This, when we limit the ESPER to, as the name says, extra sensorial PERCEPTION. A telecinetyst is not, basically, an ESPER.

[Gurm]

Drizzt,

Well, any ESPer can apply for the million dollars. A preliminary test is set up in a situation and location of the ESPer's choosing. If that involves finding a creepy place with lots of vibes emanating, so be it.

To date, nobody has even passed the preliminary test - in which they demonstrate their ability under conditions favorable to them and their so-called ability.

Again, I'm not saying that there aren't forces beyond our understanding in the universe.

What I _AM_ saying is that I haven't seen any actual ESP at work that couldn't be disproven in the light of day under the eye of cold scientific reasoning.

- Gurm