The G550 is here !!!

[rylan]

Nah, I doubt the G550 is the 'G800' or whatver that fast rumored card was. Even Matrox isn't stupid enough to release a 64-bit memory bus on a high-end card. At least I hope thats the case.

[Buback]

don't forget that the rumors have a basis. don't buy matrox's claim that it was just a made up rumor. it's specs might have been, but it was all started by the appearance of the name in the drivers.

[Ali]

Rags, I know its the internal design. BUT, pins are expensive. They have to be routed though the chip to a point where a pickup can be attached, and that isnt the easiest thing in the world to do without creating interferance problems.

If the Geforce 3 has the pins for 256bit memory, you can be pretty sure it has teh ability to use 256bit memory.

The PCB cost and design is a different matter. If you have the fastest chip out there, why make it faster, and add to the production cost if you dont need to.

I think the 6 month, or 12 month refresh of the geforce3 will have 256bit memory.

Its like the geforce2 MX can use either 128bit or 64bit SDR memory (or 64bit DDR?). The chip can do it, its up to the manufacturer to implement it.

Ali

[Greebe]

The actual cost to go from a 64 bit mem bus to a 128 bit one is about $2 and that includes cost of the PCB also, if manufactured in quanity. So a 256 bit bus should cost something like ~$5 to add (if chip was designed to support it).

Here's another example... a typical HS on todays Gcards (no fan) costs ~ 5 - 7 cents each in quanity (say 20k units).

[This message has been edited by Greebe (edited 27 June 2001).]

[This message has been edited by Greebe (edited 27 June 2001).]

[Rags]

Dan Wood does!


Rags

[bugblatt]

Hi folks, just went through this thread and, rather than start it off again in this thread, I've started a new thread in this forum called 'Greebe'. This isn't intended as a flame, or to start a flame war, but I think it needs sorting out and didn't think this thread was the place to do it.

Please post any replies to that thread.

[DuRaNgO]

Did you hear something?

[Alec]

I didn´t hear something, I read it.

[Ali]

Geebe, where do you get your figures from.

I will admit that going to 128 from 64 wouldnt cost much more in manufacturing provided you didnt have to use any more layers of PCB.

Say the G450 and G550 are using a 3 layer PCB, but to make 128bit they need 4 layers. Thats going to cost more than 3 dollars each right there. Then you have the design cost, probably only a few cents per board in quantity. Then extra traces, thats basically free. The other thing is either doubling the number of memory chips to get 128bit, or buying expensive 128bit ram over the cheap 64bit ram used today.

I read a review on some golden sample geforce2mx at toms, and its using a 6 layer PCB. Thats quite expensive, not only in the origional manufacturing cost, but also in yeilds. More complexity, lower yeilds. Its a fact of life.

I find it hard to believe that the heatsinks only cost a few cents to. The matrial cost of the aluminium is probably only a few cents. Ignore R&D, but take into account profit margins for the company making them, overheads such as capital, electricity, staff costs, setup cost etc, and I cant imagine it being worth while for anybody to take a risk for a few cents each.

Opportunity cost alone would almost make it a pointless exercise.

I might be wrong though, but I would like a link to a site that has real information about it.

Ali

[Greebe]

Ali, being in the business helps to know what I'm talking about. BTW that price excludes the cost of the memory chips.

[Ali]

OK, Ill beleive you about the 128bit to 256bit, because I dont realy know anything about it.

The heatsinks though sounds fishy.

20K units at 7 cents is $1,400.00. Thats chicken feed.

A single die for a bath tap (faucet for yanks) costs about $2000. I know I use to work at a foundry when I was at uni.

So, say you spend $2000 for a die, make 20K heat sinks, and sell them. You have lost money there.

Say you sell 40K heatsinks, you have covered the cost of the die, and have $800 to pay for the aluminium that you used. That will probably even out to breakeven.

Now, it cost you a bit in electricity, then your wages for the poor sap who has to look after the casting, the rent on the foundry, the managers wages, the owners profit, the accountants fees, the cost of the tipping machine, the packaging costs, the marketing costs, the shipping costs, I think you get the point.

7 cents each doesnt cut it.

To make it worth while you would have to be selling millions of heat sinks per week, and I dont see that happening.

Ali

[Greebe]

The HS on the G450 was a nickel each in that quantity (maybe that was in lots of 25k)

This stuff is cheap if you purchase it from the source in SE Asia in sufficient quanity.

[rylan]

The cost going fro 64-bit to 128-bit is _not_ much at all... either is 64-bit versus 128-bit DDR. I know, I hope design high-end graphics cards.. I'm not talking about 6-layer stuff.. our boards have 12+ layers.

Anyway, we have 128-bit 200MHz DDR chips that cost us $5 a piece.. yes, $5. Thats for a 128Mbit chip (16MBytes). 4 of them on the board.. $20 for 64Mbytes of DDR. Too much? Fine, use 64MBit chips.. $3 a pop, so it'll only cost $12 for 32MB of 128-bit DDR.

A 6 layer PCB isn't that expensive, as the routing isn't very difficult either.. around $20 in volume (probably less actually) for a small card like. M could've done it but they went cheap-o so they could use the G450 core and keep the crappy 64-bit wise memory interface.

[Hein]

<font face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" size="2">Originally posted by Greebe:
Ding Dong, G550 is here! </font>

Already? That was fast.

Hein.

[Greebe]

That's because Headcasting does have it's place in most countries or areas where bandwidth limitations or cost prevent teleconferencing (ie most of the world). It's always nice to know what the person you've just been talking to looks like. Now whether this is a fluke of technology or not, it is indeed interesting none the less.

It's just not something for gamers (tho it'll be implemented for those with a Sony PS2 also!)