$217,000 speeding fine

[Admiral]

Hey, I strongly agree with az on this one, let the punishment feel the same for all social classes
Perosnally, I would extend the system to all fineable offenses, if it isn't already like that.

[The PIT]

Theres also got to be a fixed lower limit or you get people who claim poverty and effectively also get off.

I used to work with a lass and we were all poorly paid. She got done for stealing from a catolugue company and ordered to pay all that was due. She pleaded poverty and was asked to pay 19p a month. She payed that and then continued stealing as there wasn't any deterant. In the end the catalogue company cured the problem, not the court, by refusing to handle the girls account anymore. Basically she got a lot of free clothing in the end. A big fine at the beginning may have detired her.

[az]

KvH, it depends. If you're driving 50 in a street where the 35 makes sense (!) - maybe because there is a kindergarten nearby, or whatever - a 200 $ fine for somebody who earns ~2000 is fine with me. Less for those who earn less, more for those who earn more. And no diminishing factors for those who earn REALLY much. Let it hurt EXACTLY the same for all people.

And yes, I know how it is to be poor. We're living off less than 1800 EUR (My girlfriend, Samira, and I). Which is part of the reason we have no car. Just as well, saves us all the fines

AZ

[Wulfman]

I'm with az. I was always wondering why we are calculating other fines in "daily rates" (tagessatz), but not traffic violations.

mfg
wulfman

[Novdid]

I also agree with az on this.

Speeding tickets should hurt and driving 80kph in a 40kph zone like this guy did, is pretty bad. Let him have it.

1 year ago I got a $100 fine for not having any lamps and reflexes on my bike, and I tell you as the poor student I am it did hurt badly. Now I don't have to tell you that have the proper lamps and reflexes on my bike after nightfall.

[Elie]

I disagree again, this is why we have a demeric point system including charges that may suspend your license.

For example, if I were to speed 30 KM over the speed limit, I will be hit with a fine plus 3-4 demeric points, and if I caused an accident or smashed into a pole because of reckless driving then I would be charged with Dangerous driving and be hit with a larger fine + even more demeric points and it gets worse from there.

Typically you start off with 15 points, if you lose enough opints you will lose your license and have to wait at least two years to start the process of getting your licence all over again. Now believe me no one wants to lose their privilege to drive.

Of course if you are caught drinking and driving then it's an immediate suspension for three months to a year I believe.

This is how it is here in Canada, and I believe it is fair to everyone.
To simply charge a rich guy that much will not deter him or her from speeding, because they can afford it.
But once they lose their license then that's a whole new ball game

Mind you, they can probably hire the best lawyers out there to reduce their sentence, but one thing they ghave to understand is no one is above the law!

Cheers,
Elie

[az]

Well... of course very rich people are already quite a bit above the law (a good lawyer will know the judge, bribery is of course more of an option when you have lots of money to offer... and don't say it isn't so, I know it is).

We also have this points system here in germany, but it has a few shortcomings: Losing three points brings you closer to losing the license, but it is not direct enough. The deterrence doesn't work as good, because you accumulate (or lose) points over time. And rich people can of course easily afford a chauffeur, thus circumventing the loss of mobility.

AZ

[Guru]

Elie we have that 2 so stop whining already!

Anyways these people make more € year then I for example make in ~1000 years!

[Guru]

He also got a speeding ticket in 2000 http://www.helsinki-hs.net/news.asp?id=20000804xx4

The guy owns a hockey team among other!

In the year 2002 he paid 6 819 356 € in income tax and 13 617 300 € in property tax (not sure if that is the right translation)!

So I guess he can afford it!

[Helevitia]

KvH,

From someone(me) who uses a disabled parking spot legitimately, I can honestly say that although some disabled spots go unused often, there are 10 times as many that get used all the time. Also, there is much abuse when it comes to disabled parking.

FYI - Disabled persons can use the metered spots for free in California.

Here in the Bay Area, CA(oakland to be exact), they did a crack down on the disabled parking in the heart of the city where tons of government workers work. Turns out that a bunch of workers were using there parents/sisters/brothers/friends placard to park illegally in the metered spots so they wouldn't have to pay. Now, since every single spot was taken up, there was no spot left for the truly disabled.

Now, I know your friend probably was in a hurry, but if I really needed that spot at that moment, and your friend was parked there, I'd be ****ed. I think he deserved it. It's just like you thinking the death penalty is warranted but others feel that is to punishable of a crime. Nothing different in what you are thining. I agree that some fines are too much, but then again, otehrs aren't enough.

Dave

[Elie]

Originally posted by Guru
Elie we have that 2 so stop whining already!

Anyways these people make more € year then I for example make in ~1000 years!

Hey Guru, whos whining? I certainly am not. Just stating the facts man just the facts

Cheers,
Elie

[Greebe]

Originally posted by az
I like the system. For someone making 2000 EUR a month, a 200 EUR speeding fine would mean a lot, someone making 500000 EUR a month would just laugh at it. Let it hurt him as much as it hurts the not-so-rich, sack the same percentage of his income that you would charge a poor man.

AZ

I'll second that! Have seen several business owners just laugh at the fines imposed.

Originally posted by KvHagedorn
[B]Well, imho, 200 EUR is too much for normal people to have to pay for speeding. Speeding fines are just a lame excuse for legalized highway robbery. A guy I work with got a $250 ticket for being parked in a handicapped spot for 2 minutes at a convenience store. This store is right across from our workplace, and I have NEVER seen a handicapped person use it. He only got the ticket because some busybody bitch insisted that a cop give it to him.

Being the parent of a handicapped child (invalid in a wheelchair no less) I could give a flying flip less who illegally parks in handicapped spots. There are so many people who abuse this it's not funny. Once you wear that shoe you might understand. I know people who have handicapped plates on their cars, but it doesn't apply to them, the driver and the person afflicted is not with them abuse this all the time. I am also sick of the police passing the buck not willing todo anything about it in most areas due to a meriad of slack jawed lame jellydonut bellied excuses.

Sorry Chuck, but I have absolutely NO pity for your friend.

Let me add that we don't have a handicapped tag or anything now and don't park in handicapped parking only out of respect for those whom really need it bad. Ryan is small enough it's not a real problem atm now that we are in a 365 day a year warm climate. Up north it was a must and did have, but we as parents never abused this when we were out alone shopping.

[Greebe]

Elie, in North Carolina they have the same system. Speed >20mph over the limit and they'll pull your license on the spot, no if's, and's or but's about it... well unless you are well connected or are a fellow cop.

If you're caught speeding more than 2X in a three month period they do the same at your manditory court appearence.

[DukeP]

I find it nice that the Fins actually use the letter of the law.

The same laws stand here in Denmark, but they are rarely used for lesser offences.

The point is good: You have a fine based on salary.

Its equal for all. You do the crime you pay, f.ex. 1days salary.
If one person earn 200$ in a days work, thats the fine. if another earns 20.000$, thats the fine for him.

Both gets fined the same relative amount.

Fixed fines are laughable.
And we doesnt even have _that_ big a spread, income wise...

Novdid: Here in Denmark students generally gets a 50% discount on fines - again based on income.

~~DukeP~~

[Maggi]

Originally posted by az
KvH, it depends. If you're driving 50 in a street where the 35 makes sense (!) - maybe because there is a kindergarten nearby, or whatever - a 200 $ fine for somebody who earns ~2000 is fine with me. Less for those who earn less, more for those who earn more. And no diminishing factors for those who earn REALLY much. Let it hurt EXACTLY the same for all people.

And yes, I know how it is to be poor. We're living off less than 1800 EUR (My girlfriend, Samira, and I). Which is part of the reason we have no car. Just as well, saves us all the fines

AZ

completely agree with you ...


the critics should keep in mind that a car is a deadly weapon, especially when speeding beyond reasonability.

Even more so in inhabited areas like cities and villages, where children are in steady danger to be run over by some private racer "that surely knows how to drive" ...

Damn, if your in such a need for speed, get NFS Underground and let of some adrenaline !