Hot car in US?

[KRSESQ]

Lately for some reason I've been wet-dreaming about this one

Actually I like the roadster better but pix are elusive.

Kevin

[Wombat]

Don't bother. The engine isn't all that hot.

[KRSESQ]

I wouldn't be getting it for the engine.

Kevin

[isochar]

I love the gangster look. They are all around ATL and every single one of them is pimpin.

[KvHagedorn]

You guys need to read GT98's link. The new engines are not based on the old hemis, but a 1965 Porsche cylinder head. The Dodge hemis of the late 60s were 426 cubic inch displacement monsters producing 425bhp or thereabouts. And the sound was distinctive. They are almost too rare and valuable to even drive now.

[KvHagedorn]

Personally, I'd go for a new Ford GT40.. but I'm not one of the few, the rich, the ****oles.

[Dr Mordrid]

Originally posted by Elie
A Turbo charged engine will compensate for altitude, all you need is a 2.5 litre 4 banger with a turbo charger and you're set.

While a turbo can compensate somewhat for altitude by increasing the air density in the intake manifold it's most effective at moderate to high RPM's and most 2.5 liter engines have very little low end torque even with a turbo. A higher displacement engine, especially one with a longish stroke, has a huge advantage in those situations.

Example: try using a 2.5 liter 4 banger to tow a camper or power an SUV in Colorado or Utah sometime. Even at low altitudes these can strain a small turbo.

Replace it with a long stroke conventionally aspirated V6 or V8 and things go much better as you have more torque...partly due to more cylinders sharing the load plus the longer stroke. Swap this for a diesel of roughly equal size and things go even better because of their inherently high low end torque.

Now put in an electric motor (ie: one of the upcoming hybrid SUV's) and things are even better since electric motors get maximum torque from almost 0 RPM. With the right controller a hybrid design can deliver massive amounts of power plus hybrids have very low mechanical losses (no need for a tranny etc.) and thus can run a smaller engine (even a gas turbine) to provide the power for the generator.

The electric motors being planned for them can run up to 100hp each, and with 4 onboard....

Dr. Mordrid

[Brian Ellis]

And what are you going to do with these when crude oil reaches $150/bbl or more, as is predicted this decade? Or when there is simply none left?

The most reliable predictions suggest that peak oil production will occur at ~2015 when prices will probably reach $200+/bbl. After, that, the prices will rise exponentiallyas production and availability will fall. The price at the pump then will probably reach Euro 20/l or $100/gal (the difference being because the exchange rate will have altered drastically). Car fuel will become low priority, so will rise in price more rapidly than essential uses of the little petroleum available to us.

IMHO, it behoves us to use the most economical cars possible so as to put off the evil day as long as possible (and reduce pollution and consequent health-care costs, to boot).

If I were able to obtain a Toyota Prius, I would get one the day I was able to drive again.

[Dr Mordrid]

This is why my post finished with a leadin to hybrid power.

IMO this is the logical next step for automobile and truck power. In reality this type of power is nothing new since it's been used very effectively in freight and passenger trains, and even some busses, for over 50 years.

What it took to start hybrids transitioning from trains to over the road vehicles was the development of small high powered electric motors, which have only been available for <10 years, and high efficiency batteries which have only came to market in the last few years.

Transitioning to hybrid power makes a lot of sense for the manufacturers as well since they are mechanically simpler which can lead to production savings once the startup costs are amortized. While the electric power controllers are expensive now with mass production they'll be much cheaper in short order.

In addition hybrids can run using numerous types of power units ranging from small gas or diesel engins to gas turbines similar to those used in aircraft APU's. Properly set up any of these can run of numerous fuels....even diesels which doesn't really require welled oil but can also run on "biodiesel"; a fuel that can be derived from biomass.

Since for the most part these power sources can be smaller and run at the most efficient RPM for the purpose lower emissions can be obtained than with power units that need inductions geared for use with direct mechanical drive.

Dr. Mordrid

[Wombat]

Originally posted by Brian Ellis
And what are you going to do with these when crude oil reaches $150/bbl or more, as is predicted this decade? Or when there is simply none left?

Neither of these things will happen - not even close. Now, don't get me wrong, I'd like to see more electric vehicles, but the battery density won't be there for years to come.

Oil has plenty of sources (since it doesn't even appear to be a "fossil fuel," and alternative combustibles are many and varied.

[KvHagedorn]

Batteries can have terrible environmental impact, as well..

I would love to see petrol reserved for special enthusiast cars like porsches and ferraris, while for everyday driving we use some form of electric/fuel cell type thing.

[Dr Mordrid]

Lack of battery density is why hybrids are becoming "the thing" now since the power unit can constantly recharge less efficient batteries on demand.

Once battery density is much higher and recharges faster there won't be any need for a fueled power unit, but until then....

Yup....you can get oil, or the functional equivalent, from many sources other than drilling for it. Such things as oil shale, biomass and many others come to mind. Problem is building the infrastructure.

Dr. Mordrid

[Brian Ellis]

I agree that hybrid cars are the only way we can reduce fuel consumption in that sector in the immediate.

You may be interested in my essay for cars in the Cyprus context here:

http://www.cypenv.org/Files/cars.htm

I do not believe in the hype re hydrogen fuel cell cars. It will require building a new 1.6 GW nuclear power station for every 200,000 cars to generate carbon-free hydrogen:

http://www.cypenv.org/Files/hydrogen.htm

(it would require about the same for electric cars, assuming suitable lightweight, low volume, batteries became available).

Yes, you can get oil from other sources, but at what price. During the war, Scottish oil shale was exploited in the Bo'ness region of W. Lothian. It was ginormously expensive in both cost and human lives (shale, being a friable rock, collapses as soon as it's looked at, as miners discovered). The mines were closed on 9 May 1945, the day after the European war ended, on the assumption that there would be no further problems in importing oil from the ME. Even so, motor fuel continued to be rationed in the UK for several years.

Biomass is a big problem: it would require about 1 km2 of land and ample water in mid-latitudes to provide average fuel requirements for a single car, not counting the fuel required to cart the growth to a processing station, nor the oil-derived chemical fertilisers necessary to sustain constant growth.

There is no easy solution to this upcoming crisis, I'm afraid. The only medium-term possibility, as I see it, is a proliferation of nuclear power stations, complemented by up to ~20% (the max practical for power distribution stability) of variable renewable sources, such as wind and solar, and as much fixed renewable sources (processing waste, such as household garbage, biomass, etc.) as is locally feasible.

Of course, as the barrel of crude hits the $100 mark, it will become more economically feasible to exploit poorer resources and to regenerate oil from used tyres, plastics, etc.

There is an interesting debate on nuclear at http://peakoil.com/fortopic354.html . Of course, it has the usual mix of wisdom and bulls**t, but it's not bad on the whole.

[DukeP]

Only problem with gas turbine hybrids (which is a GREAT idea, btw) is the insanely annoying squeak, the turbines make... Dont know if You can get around that, tho...

~~DukeP~~

[DukeP]

Oh, and You really dont need oil in a modern society.

We have a small island (Samsøe) which have been a "zero energy" island for the lsat 5 years.
They get their energy from wind, solar and biomass (mostly byproducts from their agricultur). The last 2 years the island have been a netto exporter of energy, have had a netto influx of CO2 (they are currently binding 19000tons CO2 a year more than they release) etc, etc. All without loosing their competivness as a large producer of agricultural goods.

This DOES require quite extensive investments in infrastructure (distributed hot water mains for heating, rigging all the windmills together in distribution points, establishing small powerplants to serve the outlying comunities etc).

But it goes to show that it is indeed possible, taking advantage of newish technology.

Off course- we dont NEED to be oilfree - Denmark is a net exporter of oil.
But just to be on the safe side...

(We are also the worlds largest producers of windmills).

~~DukeP~~