Since we're posting funny sites about celebrities

[Jon P. Inghram]

They deny it vigorously, and even launch smear campaigns and outright harassment (sometimes even PHYSICAL attacks) on anyone who makes too much noise about their inner workings.

A friend of my brother wrote a paper about Scientology in school and ended up getting threats, even to the point of death threats against their family if I remember correctly.

[Gurm]

A friend of my brother wrote a paper about Scientology in school and ended up getting threats, even to the point of death threats against their family if I remember correctly.

Yup. They are careful to remain anonymous, and avoid prosecution, but they DO very vigorously defend their "church" from bad-mouthing. Sadly, they consider telling the truth to be "defamation", and "death threats" to be "defense".

[schmosef]

omg, they updated the site today with a link to an interview he did on 60 minutes australia. He's INTENSE!

[TransformX]

Aren't the free-masons a bit like that too?

[schmosef]

I didn't think the free masons believed in UFOs. Do they? I don't know if they are a cult so much as a secret society. A guy I used to know said his dad was a free mason and he used to get all these special discounts and perks from other Masons that owned businesses or worked in high level positions of the service industry. For example, he never paid banking fees. He once said that there was some sort of connection to the Templar Knights and they believed that a secret sub group of the Masons were hiding the Arc of the Covenant but he didn't know any more.

[Umfriend]

Aren't the free-masons a bit like that too?

AFAIK, free-masonry differs from country to country and within coutries even somewhat from lodge (dutch "Loge") to lodge. There are rites indeed which are supposed to be secret. But I have never heard about a lodge trying to isolate its members from family and friends (or extorting members for that matter). Over here (and that may be quite different in the US for instance) it is open to people from all religions (and atheists, but some feel for spirituality would fit). The rites and other ceremonies are based on christian lore however (and/or lore taken over and transformed by christians etc).

I'd say they're pretty different, but he, similarities can be found almost anywhere.

[Umfriend]

A guy I used to know said his dad was a free mason and he used to get all these special discounts and perks from other Masons that owned businesses or worked in high level positions of the service industry. For example, he never paid banking fees.

Well, there is a concept of brother-service (Dutch: "Broederdienst") indeed. Sorta brothers helping each other out. I do not think that a member should help another at the expense of an employer (e.g. the bank not making banking fees), unless the brother actually owned the bank.

[agallag]

I didn't think the free masons believed in UFOs. Do they? I don't know if they are a cult so much as a secret society. A guy I used to know said his dad was a free mason and he used to get all these special discounts and perks from other Masons that owned businesses or worked in high level positions of the service industry. For example, he never paid banking fees. He once said that there was some sort of connection to the Templar Knights and they believed that a secret sub group of the Masons were hiding the Arc of the Covenant but he didn't know any more.

Read a little Dan Brown (DaVinci Code, Angels and Demons) for some background on the Freemasons and the Illuminati. It's probably exaggerated, and maybe even a little fictionalized, but it's interesting reading regardless whether you believe it or not.

[Umfriend]

Read a little Dan Brown (DaVinci Code, Angels and Demons) for some background on the Freemasons and the Illuminati. It's probably exaggerated, and maybe even a little fictionalized, but it's interesting reading regardless whether you believe it or not.

Just cause Brown mentions (or uses) them does not mean his works are a good reference on the topics. If you want nice fiction, go Brown, if you want to know something about free-masons, go to a library or something. Hell, go to a lodge and they'll probably tell you which books are good to read on them. No copyrighted or trademarked material. just very very secret

[Jammrock]

This is one of the reasons (don't go getting bent, Jammrock - we've already discussed that your people aren't like this)

Damn, spoiling all my fun already.

...that folks get all bent out of shape about Mormons...

I don't believe you! Since when?

Their EXTERNAL presentation is the stuff in the Book of Mormon. I think it's silly, but it's pretty much just a branch of Christianity.

To each his own.

But their INTERNAL presentation involves Temple Rites, and all kinds of OTHER strange stuff.

Technically, if someone is given the "presentation" by missionaries they are told about temples, and that there are rites done there including baptism for the dead (or posthumous baptism as you call it). We don't go into detail about the rites, not even among ourselves, unless we are in a temple.

They VIGOROUSLY deny it, or try to spin it, but that's how it is.

Deny that we have special "rites" that we do in the temple? I suppose some might. Like I said, we don't give details, but I've never known someone to deny that we have special rites in the temple ... because we do. I mean, that's where we get married, or are supposed to. And quite honestly, having been to several weddings both inside and outside temples, I prefer the temple ones because they are small, short, simple, and beautiful.

ANd it's not like we hid them or anything. We have over 100 of them around the world. You can even see pictures and get info about them online on the official church website (not trying to be preachy, just for informations sake):

http://www.lds.org/temples/home/0,11273,1896-1,00.html

As for the other "rites", they're not as freaky as some poeple may try to say they are. Like this one girl who thought that we sacrificed women who were unmarried by 21-years old. Ew... But they don't involve animal sacrifice or anything freaky like that. Wierd ... depends on the person. Freaky, no.

They even "posthumously baptized" some of the worst people in recent history (for presumably good reasons, but since when can you posthumously baptize ANYONE?) such as Hitler and Stalin... and then worked REALLY hard to pretend they hadn't.

Rule of thumb, "baptism them all." But I must qualify this...although we will "posthumously baptize" anyone, we DO NOT believe that they will be saved no matter what they did in life. My mom has done work for Vikings in our family. Will they be "saved" even though they were baptized. Probably not, but we do it anyway, because that's what we do. We're wierd like that. ...and many other ways...but then so are you. Yes you! And you know it!

But to get back on track, Scientology VERY SPECIFICALLY isolates its members. You should read the testimony of some former members, they tell SCARY stories about being forbidden to have outside friends, how the church takes over your life, watches over you 24/7 to make sure you're not straying, etc. etc.

I know several churches like that. In fact, many true orthodox-like religions are like that. Maybe not to the Scientology extent, but they are there.


As for Mr. Cruise ... having dealt with MANY hardcore religious types from MANY different religions, I can say for certain that Tom has reached "that point." "That point" is where a person's religion has taken over so much that they cease being and individual and become some type of odd "clone" of everyone else who has reached that point within their group. Typical signs of reaching "that point" are:

1. Glazed look in their eyes, whether they're on drugs or not.
2. Always have "that smile" on their face, like Jack Nicholson's Joker in the original Tim Burton Batman movie.
3. No matter what they do or say they just seem "fake." They can be completely and honestly sincere but they still seem fake, like you just can't trust them.
4. They can't say more than four sentences without bringing in their beliefs into the conversation.
5. Anyone who doesn't believe what they believe is not fully trusted, to the point that they act like everyone else is out to persecute them specifically because of what they believe.

Tom Cruise is at "that point." Tom Cruise needs to go into detox.

Jammrock

[Dr Mordrid]

Have very close friends who are Mormon. They are not weirdos or anything like it...far from it...they are probably some of the "straightest" people I know. Big into charity and community, even those not in their own group.

As for Masons; my father in law was a high level Mason. Again big into charity (worked a lot with the Shrine Circus to benefit their childrens hospitals) and community service. You'll find quite a few Masons among the police and fire depts or sometimes in medical fields.

Not to say that either doesn't have the odd tradition or two, but nothing more outrageous than any other group and certainly less so than any Greek house on campus

Dr. Mordrid