The PIT gets done for speeding

[The PIT]

Lets his attenion slip for one second and whoops.

One of those ssneaky little vans which I did spot but too late so it was a case of waiting for the letter to turn up which it did.

Worrying though was the speed they said I was doing.

They reckon I was doing 49 mph in a 30 mph zone.

The highest I was doing was 45 mph so allowing for the speedo that would roughtly be 41 mph. Annoying I already noticed this and was correcting it. Can't plead with a camera though can you.

So even if I was doing 30 mph theres a good chance I'd still have got done.

[ZokesPro]

I got pulled over last wednesday for not properly stopping at a stop sign. And for the first time inages, I got a warning! Didn't think cops gave warnings, was nice of them. Since then, I've been actually stopping at stop signs.

Warnings DO work.

[The PIT]

I got pulled over last wednesday for not properly stopping at a stop sign. And for the first time inages, I got a warning! Didn't think cops gave warnings, was nice of them. Since then, I've been actually stopping at stop signs.

Warnings DO work.

Pends how they do the warning.

If they're aggressive over baring and try to intimdate you it's likely to have the opposite effect. Certainly did for me when I got pulled over in this village that I had never sped through until I changed the car that day. A few feet at 34 mph before I breaked. Breaking of course got the copper to pull me over. What followed was the most one of the most stupid bit of policing I've been on the end off. The result? I now speed through the village not massively and the rear view mirror goes on overtime while I'm doing it.

Sadly camera's and radar guns don't warn you.

[ND66]

... And for the first time inages, I got a warning! Didn't think cops gave warnings, was nice of them.

Senior Citizen discount?




.

[ZokesPro]

Senior Citizen discount?




.

If it means not getting a ticket? SURE!!!

[ND66]

If it means not getting a ticket? SURE!!!

On top of getting older? Sure!


.

[Fat Tone]

...They reckon I was doing 49 mph in a 30 mph zone.

The highest I was doing was 45 mph so allowing for the speedo that would roughtly be 41 mph....

If you are sure of your speed it could be worth forcing them to produce a valid calibration certificate for the device. Even though you were still speeding by your own admission you could get off on a technicality.

I have an SP30 (driving 38 in a 30) that is now over 4 years old so the points on my license don't count, but I still have to declare it until next January. Its a pain in the butt when filling in insurance quote forms!

And you 'allowing for the speedo' comment reminds me that there is always a large discrepancy between my speedo and what my satnav reports...probably the only reason I've never been done for speeding on a Motorway.

[The PIT]

Your speedo should always be higher than your actual speed by now more than 10%.

Not worth contesting in court as 20 mph over the limit could make things a lot worse. The Police would produce a valid cert anyway even if it belonged to another device.

[Fat Tone]

Why should it always be higher?

As to not contesting you are probably right, but if it really mattered (say the extra points would cause a ban) and you thought you had a case then I think it is. All the devices have to be calibrated on a regular basis and have a certificate tracable to a NAMAS accredited laboratory. There will be a very strong paper trail.

[Jon P. Inghram]

They reckon I was doing 49 mph in a 30 mph zone.

The highest I was doing was 45 mph so allowing for the speedo that would roughtly be 41 mph. Annoying I already noticed this and was correcting it. Can't plead with a camera though can you.

I see the problem, you're using the wrong scale on your speedometer.

[Brian Ellis]

Most speedos are only ~5% fast. I've not had one that was 10% fast for over 25 years. I always calibrate my speedos with a chronometer. In the late 1950s, when radars were new, I overtook a lorry at about 30 mph along a straight road leading into Stockton on Tees, when I saw, as I was pulling back to the left, that I was heading straight towards a radar. Sure enough, I was stopped by the reception committee a coupla hundred metres farther on and told I was doing 35 mph in a 30 zone. I denied it, but it was put down on the charge sheet at 35 less 3 mph tolerance = 32 mph. I chose to appear before the magistrates, rather than pay the £8 fine. When asked whether guilty, I said not. Asked whether I would be willing to rely on the judgement of the magistrate's court, I agreed. So the copper who filled in the charge sheet was called and gave his spiel. Did I have anything to ask him.

"What was I doing when I approached the radar"

"I don't know, I didn't see it, I was stopping offenders after receiving number plate and speed information by walkie-talkie from my colleague manning the radar."

"So you didn't see that I was pulling in after completing an overtaking manoeuver?"

"No"

"Have you heard of the cosine factor?"

"No"

"You don't know then that the indication of speed can change according to the angle the car approaches the radar?"

"No"

"When you set up a radar, you check its calibration by a police car with a calibrated speedometer going along the road, parallel to the side of the road, at the exact speed limit?"

"Yes, that is the procedure; it is done twice before checking the speed of other cars and once at the end of the session."

(BE, addressing the bench). "I am an electronics engineer and I know exactly how these radars work. I can assure you that the calibration is done with the radar beam being cut by the car at 15° from the axis of the road. Any greater angle would reduce the reading and any smaller angle would increase the reading. As I was pulling in from overtaking, I could see that I was heading straight towards the radar, which would therefore read 3.53% too high, so my real speed was less than 31 mph."

(Bench to cop) "Is this true?"

"I don't know"

"Is the radar operator available, in court?"

Loud kerfuffle for 2 minutes: clerk says negative.

(Bench, after a minute of talking amongst themselves, to cop) "It is intolerable that the radar operator cannot testify before this bench: we insist that he be present for all future cases brought before us. We understand that there are more speeding cases coming before us. We cannot hear these cases."

(Bench, to me) "As it happens, I am a mathematics professor at Durham University. Your cosine factor explanation seems very plausible. As there is no witness to testify that you were completing an overtaking, we have no option but to dismiss the case."

Explanation: at the time (maybe still the case), all criminal cases were initially brought before a magistrates' court. All but minor misdemeanours were sent to a higher court. The magistrates (Justice of the Peace) are not, in any way, legally trained and were named from "notables", such as city councillors, teachers or professionals, to hear minor cases and, if the defendant is found guilty, or admits it, pass sentence according to a scale for the offence, under the advice of the Clerk, who is a lawyer. If in doubt or in case of disagreement amongst the three magistrates on the bench, then the case is referred to a higher court. The defendant can always appeal, but it is rare for the prosecution to appeal.

[The PIT]

Well Brian I was caught coming off a roundabout hence the false high speed reading. I was speeding anyway but like I said if I was doing 30 mph I reckon I still would have been done.

What you said still applies but who's the uneducated judge going to believe.

In this country we have a signs that say slow down and flash the speed limit at you if you're going above the limit. I was once over taking a lorry doing 25 mph and I was 30 mph and this sign was going crazy. Basically it was picking up a growing lorry and saying hey this is going fast.

[The PIT]

I see the problem, you're using the wrong scale on your speedometer.

You know I was once coming back from work and I was stuck in a line of cars going fairly slowly. The idiot in front had a forgien number plate and was doing 70 kph not 70 mph.

Doh. Took me ages to get past the bar steward and I had to do it on the left very slowly.

[Jon P. Inghram]

Most speedos are only ~5% fast. I've not had one that was 10% fast for over 25 years. I always calibrate my speedos with a chronometer.

Measured via GPS, my old '87 Cavalier it was dead-on accurate with the stock size tires. My new '07 Aveo5 on the other hand reads maybe 3% high.

The PIT, I'm a little confused, are the speed limits actually marked in MPH in the UK?

[Sasq]

Measured via GPS, my old '87 Cavalier it was dead-on accurate with the stock size tires. My new '07 Aveo5 on the other hand reads maybe 3% high.

The PIT, I'm a little confused, are the speed limits actually marked in MPH in the UK?

Everything else in the UK went meteric except the roads I believe