NSF Elie

[cjolley]

Not safe for Elie

http://www.cnn.com/video/#/video/us/2009/08/14/delozier.maserati.cash.KUSA

[Dr Mordrid]

You trying to give the poor boy a stroke or sumthin'?

[KRSESQ]

A little sad. But according to the previous owner he couldn't drive it more than 100 miles without taking it to a mechanic. So if it was a lemon then it probably wasn't much of a loss.

Kevin

[Kruzin]

I believe Maseratti is Italian for 'Lemon'.


Face it...The whole CARS program is a sham. It's only goal is to get people with money to spend it...thus 'stimulating the economy', and getting some cash back into the auto makers the gov just spent billions upon billions bailing out.

IF it was even a little bit about getting clunkers off the road, it would extend to '73 (or even older) model years, and not just newer models. You know...REAL clunkers.
If it was about getting rid of guzzlers, you would have to get something significantly more fuel efficent. As it is, you only have to get something that gets 3mpg better than what you are clunking.
Vehicles like Hummers and Tahoes are eligible new buys, as long as they get 3 mpg better than whatever you clunk.

So you clunk a viable, usable 15mpg vehicle for a 18mpg one. All that's accomplished here is they got you to spend your money. Meanwhile, there's a family who would LOVE to have that 15mpg good condition ride over their truely unsafe, oil burning, 11mpg '78 Cutlass.

Admittedly, many heaps are being clunked...but thousands and thousands of GOOD vehicles are being sent to the crusher for no good reason.
Vehicles that could be put to good use, and are very desirable to those driving the REAL clunkers.

The whole thing pisses me off....

[Dr Mordrid]

^^^^^^----what he said.

I know this isn't the political forum, but really now - this, the 'stimulus', the 'omnibus spending bill' and now an abortive health care plan that neither improves health care/saves money/reforms tort law is why the polls for the Prez and Congress are in the toilet and still dropping.

None of 'em have the common sense God gave a gopher.

[Kruzin]

^^^^^^----what he said.

WOW..did Doc just agree with me??
First time for everything :P

There are many you-tube videos of really nice vehicles being clunked.
Vehicles that could easily go another 100k miles, and are in much better shape, and more environment friendly than so many cars I see on the road each day. It's just wrong. So many people could use those vehicles to better their lives, and get rid of the junk they drive...which would also be better for the environment than crushing the better vehicles.

For those unfamiliar with the CARS program.
Only 83 and newer vehicles are eligable...regardless of condition.

New vehicles purchased only have to get 3mpg better than the clunked vehicle.

If you can afford a new car, the gov will pay you to crush your good car. If you can't afford a new car, or drive an older car...tough nuggets, yer screwed.

Vehicles that are clunked:
-Can not be resold to individuals
-Engines are SEIZED. locked. trashed...never to run again.
-Can not be re-titled EVER...not even a salvage title
-Must be sold to approved recyclers
-Approved recyclers have 90 days to salvage what they can from that vehicle
-Recyclers can sell only certain parts (body parts, individual drivetrain pieces (but not connected drivetrain parts (can't buy a tranny AND a tcase at the same time)))
-After 90 days, that vehicle MUST be crushed/shredded, no matter how many good parts remain on it.

So....
If you can afford a new car payment, the gov will pay you to trash your good car...screw those who can't afford a new car payment and want your good used cars...

[cjolley]

Hey, don't piss on the funeral guys.
Think of poor Elie

[Kruzin]

Hey, don't piss on the funeral guys.
Think of poor Elie

Hey, we all have our dream cars.
Mine is also Italian. But at least mine has a Ford power plant.
Elies fault he chose the Yugo of Italians

I love my Jeeps (and many are being needlessly sacrificed in this program), hate to see them shredded...but if I saw a DeMatosa Pantera crushed, I'd shed a tear.
At least The Panteras aren't eligable for this program

[TransformX]

I can't believe it.. Change the friggin engine! You don't ruin this whole beauty just because the engine's bad!

[cjolley]

Hey, we all have our dream cars.

Mine is a VW bug.
I could take the engine out of an old one in 10 min with my eyes closed.
And put it back in in about 15.
It would be really fun to own one again, but I don't want to own 3 cars and there's no way I would put my daughter in one of those death traps.

[Dr Mordrid]

I want my '57 Chevy Bel Air back

[KRSESQ]

I've got it all figured out. I'm going to buy all the parts online and build myself a brand new 1971 Camaro.

Kevin

[cjolley]

I want my '57 Chevy Bel Air back

Heh, we had a 62 Bel Air, painted metal dashboard and all.
283 V8.
Got it up to 120mph in High School on the Autobahn in Germany.
It was never the same again

[Brian Ellis]

The clunker law here is different.

1. The vehicle must be 15 or more years old (soon to be reduced to 10)
2. To get the full rebate (€2000, I think), it must have been running over the past three years (ie, road tax paid, MOT safety tested). I believe there is a €800 rebate if it is missing only this year's tax, but the 2 previous years have been paid..
3. There must be a trade-in for a new fuel efficient vehicle, defined according to the use. A family car for a family of 5 or under persons must have emissions <150 g CO2/km. If less than 110 g/km (e.g. hybrid or toy diesel), then there is an additional subsidy of €1700 (with or without a clunker trade-in). If the requirement is for a pick-up or van for professional purposes or car for large families, the permitted emissions may be higher, but the clunker must be for similar usage.
4. The dealer is responsible for taking the clunker to a wrecking yard after destroying the engine, including carburettor/injection system and exhaust system, with paper trail.

This has been relatively successful; I forget the latest figures but I think it was over 15% of eligible vehicles have been traded in. Visibly, there are fewer really old cars on the road now, as the clunker rebate is worth more than the vehicle itself.

There are very few Italian "penis extension" cars here. Same with Rolls or Merc 600s. I've seen only one Hummer. This is because of taxation. The tax on a Hummer is €29,600 and the import duty is more than as much again, so you are looking at a 6-figure price tag, plus massive annual road tax and insurance costs. Most of the "keeping up with the Jones's cars" are under 3 l engines, often the cheaper Mercs, BMWs, Lexus and Audis plus the odd Landcruiser or Freelander: even these are much more expensive than most places elsewhere. Reasonable-cost motoring requires a 2 l engine or under.

[Sasq]

I'm not sure if we have a 'clunker' law here.
Vehcicle's go through a 'shakken' at 3, 5, 8 and 10 years for new, and every 2 years after that.
full road worthy, emission check etc

A shakken costs about $1500, so your 8 year old car suddenly starts getting expensive.
road tax is based on CC of the engine, mine runs about $400 a year, the 600cc or less cars run to about $50 a year, and their 'shakken' is mostly tire kicking and cheap.

road tax also goes up after the car is 10 years old.

Personally I own an 11 year old car - mostly as its my first car here, cost me $2k7 from the dealer before its shakken and other on roads, and I only have 3rd party ins on it until my no-claim builds up and its 'viable' to own a new car.

Oh and Tokyo no longer has smog warning days.