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  • Apple's Touch ID defeated

    That didn't take long.

    Breaking news and analysis from Canada and around the world for politics, COVID-19, racial injustice, travel, weather, entertainment, lotto and more.


    BOSTON (Reuters) - A group of German hackers claimed to have cracked the iPhone fingerprint scanner on Sunday, just two days after Apple Inc(NSQ:AAPL) launched the technology that it promises will better protect devices from criminals and snoopers seeking access.

    If the claim is verified, it will be embarrassing for Apple which is betting on the scanner to set its smartphone apart from new models of Samsung Electronics Co Ltd and others running the Android operating system of Google Inc (NSQ:GOOG).

    Two prominent iPhone security experts told Reuters that they believed the German group, known as the Chaos Computing Club, or CCC, had succeeded in defeating Apple's Touch ID, though they had not personally replicated the work.

    One of them, Charlie Miller, co-author of the iOS Hacker's Handbook, described the work as "a complete break" of Touch ID security. "It certainly opens up a new possibility for attackers."

    Apple representatives did not respond to requests for comment.

    CCC, one the world's largest and most respected hacking groups, posted a video on its website that appeared to show somebody accessing an iPhone 5S with a fabricated print. The site described how members of its biometrics team had cracked the new fingerprint reader, one of the few major high-tech features added to the latest version of the iPhone.

    The group said they targeted Touch ID to knock down reports about its "marvels," which suggested it would be difficult to crack.

    "Fingerprints should not be used to secure anything. You leave them everywhere, and it is far too easy to make fake fingers out of lifted prints," a hacker named Starbug was quoted as saying on the CCC's site.

    The group said it defeated Touch ID by photographing the fingerprint of an iPhone's user, then printing it on to a transparent sheet, which it used to create a mold for a "fake finger."

    CCC said similar processes have been used to crack "the vast majority" of fingerprint sensors on the market.

    "I think it's legit," said Dino Dai Zovi," another co-author of the iOS Hacker's Handbook. "The CCC doesn't fool around or over-hype, especially when they are trying to make a political point."

    Touch ID, which was only introduced on the top-of-the-line iPhone 5S, lets users unlock their devices or make purchases on iTunes by simply pressing their finger on the home button. It uses a sapphire crystal sensor embedded in the button.
    >
    Dr. Mordrid
    ----------------------------
    An elephant is a mouse built to government specifications.

    I carry a gun because I can't throw a rock 1,250 fps

  • #2
    More interestingly, where is the biometric data for the fingerprints stored with Apple devices?

    Does it happen to be in the cloud and/or accessible to Apple?

    Comment


    • #3
      Supposedly some theoretically inaccessible to intrusion place within the phone, which I giggled at since if the OS can see it....
      Dr. Mordrid
      ----------------------------
      An elephant is a mouse built to government specifications.

      I carry a gun because I can't throw a rock 1,250 fps

      Comment


      • #4
        It is a general problem with this type of finger print sensors. It is a hack shown in many crime movies: take a finger print, transfer it to a medium and put it on the scanner. Not really a hack of the device, but rather of the type of technology used.
        Fingerprint sensors that require you to swipe the sensor rather than just put your finger on it are less likely to be hacked in such a way.

        A cartoonist (Lectrr) had a funny cartoon), with a guy in the shop and the salesperson:
        - This new iPhone with fingerprint sensor, is it easier to use?
        - Well, it is for the NSA...


        Jörg
        pixar
        Dream as if you'll live forever. Live as if you'll die tomorrow. (James Dean)

        Comment


        • #5
          I think Apple will go the way of Blackberry.

          They don't know whether they want to be devices or services company. At devices Samsung is pwning them and most people I know who spend lots of money on phones (business people, geeks, Asians, drug dealers...) have Galaxies now. Half year old Galaxy S4 is better in screen res, battery life, megapixels, CPU clock than new iPhone 5S and 200 EUR cheaper. Fingerprint sensor and amber flash are just gimmicks.

          With their high priced devices which are only in the top bracket (what would be wrong by releasing 300-400 EUR midrange phone) they are loosing marketshare, number of developers and once their store and ecosystem become inferior they loose leverage over carriers, content and app producers. Once they start being perceived as legacy by hipsters (like Nokia and Blackberry) not as many people want to pay premium price.

          Here is history
          1999 Blackberry comes out
          2002 Symbian comes out
          2003 Exchange 2003 comes out, supports active sync, no need for additional app, proprietary protocol, carrier involvement for email
          2005 Windows Mobile 5 comes out, blackberry reaches peak in 2006
          2007 iPhone comes out drives final nail in the coffin
          2010 Nokia peaks
          2012 Android devices and experience reach parity with iPhone, iPhone peaks in 2013
          2013 Blackberry irrelevant, surpassed by Windows Phone
          ...

          3-4 years after competition comes out with something better, phone maker peaks. After one more cycle they are irrelevant.
          Last edited by UtwigMU; 23 September 2013, 05:54.

          Comment


          • #6
            They also are facing an image problem: young people are less attracted by e.g. an iPhone, because their parents have it (so it is not "cool" anymore).
            I don't think they will go the way of the BlackBerry, but they will loose their appeal.

            IMO, Apple did a stupid move by abandoning the dock connector. Many people have devices that dock an iPhone/iPod (and even worse: such devices are still sold in shops, even though now you know it will be obsolete once the iPhone/iPod dies), and they should not have betrayed that userbase. They could have used some of the currently unused pins if they needed added functionality, but at least kept backwards compatibility (or made a much better fitting adapter). Now, it opens the door to people moving to an Android device, as it is no different from a new iPhone/iPod (in that it can also not use the dock).

            They need something new, and do it better than other companies, but it gets more and more difficult.
            pixar
            Dream as if you'll live forever. Live as if you'll die tomorrow. (James Dean)

            Comment


            • #7
              I'd never go back now given my experience with the fast quad & graphics, memory expandability and full HD 5.5" screen on this Optimus G Pro. Makes the iPhone look pretty sad, and several family members are drooling over it. Grandson already bought his.

              Thing is a lot of makers are coming out with this kind of beast but all Apple is doing is nibble around the edges.
              Last edited by Dr Mordrid; 23 September 2013, 11:58.
              Dr. Mordrid
              ----------------------------
              An elephant is a mouse built to government specifications.

              I carry a gun because I can't throw a rock 1,250 fps

              Comment


              • #8
                Actually the SoC in the new iPhone 5s is very impressive (compared to the latest of their competition). Unfortunately for Apple, according to many reviews, IOS 7 seems to be not as polished as previous 'final' IOS releases have been.

                That, and Apple seems reluctant to go the big screen route.

                Personally, I think both big screens and touch screens are an abomination for cellphones. But I'm not the average buyer, so what do I know...

                Comment


                • #9
                  I wanted a cheap Bluetooth phone for my car and went to my usual IT supplier (the largest on the island) who sells almost every make and model under the sun. In the end, after trying a Symbian Nokia which wouldn't transfer the phonebook to the car (incidentally neither will any of the iPhones), I opted for the Samsung Galaxy Y. This cost me the princely sum of €95 and it will do anything that ordinary people want of a phone, such as SMS, MMS, Bluetooth, WiFi, MP3, e-mail, browsing, HD camera/video, 3G, memory expansion, Google Play to download apps, even GPS and voice recognition. OK, the screen is smaller than its more expensive brothers and I have to turn it to horizontal for my ham fists to use the keyboard when I don't want to use the VR for messaging and it may be slower but, what the hell, it works impeccably. Its Bluetooth also works with all functions in my car, including phonebook transfer and listening to MP3s, which is why I chose it. I can also stream video via Filmon with it!

                  As it was a slack moment in the shop, I chatted with the vendor and he told me he sold many more Samsungs than Apple, Nokia, HTC, Blackberry, Sony and a couple of other makes combined, and the most popular model was the Galaxy Y which is what youngsters can afford. After that, the higher spec Galaxies won hands down, especially among business people. To use his words, if he sells two or three iPhones per week, he considers himself lucky and those mainly to either young geeks from rich families or adults who "have been told they're the best" but are not techie-minded!

                  The guy opened the cupboard with Samsung phones to serve me. My guestimate is that he had nearly 100 Galaxy Ys and as many again of other Galaxies in stock, from half a minute it was open while he found the colour I wanted. From that, I guess that what he said was credible.

                  I asked him also about tablets. This was a different department, but he thought iPads sold well, about half their total sales. They have stopped selling the ultra-cheap models like Coby. Mine, which I had bought from them ~6 months ago, is an Archos 10.1" Platinum, and I'm delighted with it for €210. Forget whether it is Ice Cream Sandwich or Jelly Bean, but it has a 1.6 GHz dual processor and 20 Gb RAM!!!
                  Brian (the devil incarnate)

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    it will do anything that ordinary people want of a phone, such as SMS, MMS, Bluetooth, WiFi, MP3, e-mail, browsing, HD camera/video, 3G, memory expansion, Google Play to download apps, even GPS and voice recognition.
                    How the phone has changed from 10 years ago...Even I am getting old.
                    Join MURCs Distributed Computing effort for Rosetta@Home and help fight Alzheimers, Cancer, Mad Cow disease and rising oil prices.
                    [...]the pervading principle and abiding test of good breeding is the requirement of a substantial and patent waste of time. - Veblen

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                    • #11
                      If finances are good at the end of year and government doesn't bleed me dry with taxes I'll get a Jolla.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Umfriend View Post
                        How the phone has changed from 10 years ago...Even I am getting old.
                        Yes, it is going incredibly fast. Samsung even had the idea that your phone would be your computer, and you just dock it where you go. It was on sale, but they abandoned it (limited OS). Even now there are concepts that the phone would be your gaming machine, and it is possible: connect phone via HDMI to tv, and use a bluetooth gamepad. It is really weird.

                        I too was surprised by the list Brian posted, but it is true - even if some features are rather occasionally used. My colleague went to South Korea, and he said it is strange: people are walking with their phone in their hands, all the time looking at it... To me it feels like a step too far...

                        What's next?
                        (I don't believe in big success for Google Glass. Even though it would facilitate some things, people don't want to be consciously reminded of how dependant they have become of a device. At least a phone gives a sense of control, as you *can* put it in your pocket)
                        pixar
                        Dream as if you'll live forever. Live as if you'll die tomorrow. (James Dean)

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Google Glass is just the beginning - prepare yourselves for contact lens and implantable displays. DoD is working with an outfit that plans to market the v1.0 contact lens tech by the end of next year.
                          Dr. Mordrid
                          ----------------------------
                          An elephant is a mouse built to government specifications.

                          I carry a gun because I can't throw a rock 1,250 fps

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            I know... but I'm not sure the majority is ready for that. Glasses are quit "interfering", and lenses are even worse. Like I said: a phone gives a sense of control: it is a device, and I can put it away when I want to. Glasses and lenses are different. I for one would not want it for regular usage: to many distractions. I have a smartwatch (that came with my phone), and while I can see some benefits (e.g. knowing that your phone rings when you don't hear it in a winter jacket, quick read of a message, ...), you have to think: how often do you need all time online access?
                            pixar
                            Dream as if you'll live forever. Live as if you'll die tomorrow. (James Dean)

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