What a bunch of f***ing cowards.

[impact]

Ahh, KvH has finally calmed down so I guess it's safe to reply now.

I wasn't saying that american planes are coming in to slaughter thousands of innocent civillians. They wouldn't dare to do that, I hope (well with Bush in the lead, everything is possible and the so-called 'mistakes' happen...). I just said that the majority of Afghanistan's population, yeah those normal people, should they face AC-130, will not have many options except for wait and die or run and die.

[KvHagedorn]

I wasn't saying that american planes are coming in to slaughter thousands of innocent civillians. They wouldn't dare to do that, I hope (well with Bush in the lead, everything is possible and the so-called 'mistakes' happen...). I just said that the majority of Afghanistan's population, yeah those normal people, should they face AC-130, will not have many options except for wait and die or run and die.

So what's your point? Yeah, if SOMEONE appeared over Prague with an AC130 and wanted to wipe out a bunch of people that would be bad too. Why don't you discuss reality instead of being a seditionist? This is a war, and, strange as it may seem, the Czech Republic is now a full-fledged NATO member. NATO has confirmed that "an attack upon one of its members is an attack upon all," so guess what? Your country is now an ally of the United States in this war against terrorist states. That means when you spout all this terrorist sympathiser bullshit, you are a traitor. Now who do you think is going to come to your country with ill intent to kill you? Do you think the United States is going to fly over with an AC130? Are we the enemy? Or is Al Queda (which hides among the vast numbers of middle easterners who have infiltrated Europe) more likely to kill innocent people there? Get your head out of your ass and figure it out, because you just look stupid as it is, unless you are really on the side of the terrorists. If you are, maybe we should forward your address to the local police.

[Pneumatic]

I just said that the majority of Afghanistan's population, yeah those normal people, should they face AC-130, will not have many options except for wait and die or run and die.

If an AC-130 flew over MY house I wouldn't have much choice either. Guess what, that's not going to happen. Like I said before AMERICA DOES NOT TARGET CIVILLIANS!!! So cut out the "those poor Afghanistans" talk.

I am still waiting for you to give the example of America specifically targeting Afghan citizens.

[impact]

They are not intentionally targetting civillians. However, civillians are still going to die, no matter what Mr. Bush says. Afterall, it's a war. Get it through your thick head. What if there was a hypothetical village that had a barracks/rocket site/fuel tanks etc... will they ignore it, or will they blow up the military installation together with the rest of the village? Or, what if those taliban troops start using (they already started, didn't they) live shield/hide in their sacred places? Or, should the ground troops ever enter Afghanistan, how will they distinguish between innocents and terorist? Will they just kill them all on behalf of the "you live in afghanistan, so you must be my enemy" rule that so many americans have adopted. Raises a lot of questions, y'know?

And yeah, as a NATO member, my country has offered our help and our best troops to support you. What more do you want? Me to kiss your ass just because your politicians annoyed a lot of people in middle east and now face the wrath of the muslim world? Here, I'll give you a quarter. Call someone who cares.

Basically, I'd like to second what laureijs said. I'm not pro-terror, but I don't support your military actions either. If I could choose, I'd choose the world without both terror and wars. But I can't. Those damn americans keep ****ing things up. :P

[Gurm]

Our politicians ANNOYED a lot of people?

Exactly what could we have done that was different?

And don't EVEN say that we should have stayed away from the whole Israel mess, or I'll << expletives deleted >>

- Gurm

P.S. They are angry because we exist. Period. We are an affront to their sensibilities. Well guess what? They are an affront to MY sensibilities. And my side has nukes. Game, set, match.

[Pneumatic]

Originally posted by impact
What if there was a hypothetical village that had a barracks/rocket site/fuel tanks etc... will they ignore it, or will they blow up the military installation together with the rest of the village?

So it's our fault that those spineless cowards put the citizens between themselves and their opponents? And we are supposed to just say "Oh well, I guess we can't get that target"? I think not. By putting their own citizens in harms way they are more guilty than we are.

Do you know where US's military installations are? In the middle of nowhere! We don't surround them with schools and Churches. Do you know why? BECAUSE WE DON'T WANT INNOCENT PEOPLE TO DIE! The Afghans don't extend that same courtesy to their citizens.

Impact, standing up for those murderous, cowardly, spineless pieces of crap says a LOT about YOU.

[The PIT]

Back to harsh language then.
Oh Impact you agree that Israel shouldn't be there. The people ****ing things up aren't Americans is ass holes like you in dream worlds and terrorists and fanatics who just like killing people who just don't agree with them.
Perhaps we should have good game of football and if bin laden wins the penatly shoot out the western world including you kills itself.

[KvHagedorn]

What if there was a hypothetical village that had a barracks/rocket site/fuel tanks etc... will they ignore it, or will they blow up the military installation together with the rest of the village?

If I really was an innocent civilian and did not support the Taliban, I would not hang around in that villiage, would you? And if I were OBL or his operatives, do you know what I would do? I would put on a veil and walk out of Afghanistan with the millions of refugees, while American soldiers just stood there and watched. These people are so evil they use the honorable nature of Westerners against them. We need to check under those veils no matter who it offends, and we need to examine every male leaving to see if he might be a terrorist (if he's an Arab between 15-50 he probably is). We may have no choice but to kill civilians, that's very true. Tough shit. If they don't want to be combatants, they need to steer far away from soldiers and terrorists.

[omegaRED]

Eurotrash??? Nazis??? Come on Gurm, tell us how you REALLY feel.

[Joel]

Those damn americans keep ****ing things up.

Yea, that's right. Go ahead and continue to blame the US for everyone else's f***ups. It's always easier to do that than admit that you were wrong.

I have questions for you though. In the entire history of the US name me one war that we started? And civil war doesn't count. Now name me the wars that we didnt' start but helped to end once we were asked to help? And after all those other wars who was the biggest contributor to the reconstruction of the war torn countries? And some of this was even before we were number one.

Joel

[The PIT]

I think Gurm has forgotten a lot of the the eurotrash is supporting America. I'm certainly do not hate jews and I'm not a Nazi.

[KvHagedorn]

But I forgot - I like to tell myself that the world is a different place, but all you ****ing Eurotrash are really just anti-semitic nazi ****s anyway.

Gurm, they aren't Nazis.. if they were, they would have kicked the Turks and Arabs out long ago, and Europe wouldn't be threatened with terror. They are just weak-kneed. Funny how Jews and Nazis are on the same side now, huh?

Impact isn't the enemy, he's just deluded. Like we all do, he wants peace, but he just doesn't understand that the other guys want war. When someone wants to make war on you, you are obligated to return the favor.. it's not like we have the choice to make, so whether you object to military action or not, it HAS to happen. If we didn't make it happen, we would be irresponsible.. animals prey upon the weak.. you would do well to learn that lesson, Impact.

Yes, we are grateful for the support we are getting. Thankfully the majority in Europe is mature enough to understand that appeasement will get us nowhere, and that their liberal attitudes have made them even more vulnerable than the US. Unfortunately, there are a lot of people over there who haven't taken their heads out of the sand yet.. we have them here, too, protesting on campuses like it was still the 60s. It is impossible to think of these people as having any sense whatsoever, though. The enemy is not Hitler or the military-industrial complex anymore, so get over it.

[The PIT]

"Unfortunately, there are a lot of people over there who haven't taken their heads out of the sand yet.. we have them here, too, protesting on campuses like it was still the 60s."

True so true.

[RedRed]

Thank you for you measured response Helevitia, and you too Gurm

You dont know me gurm - dont call me anti-semitic. You might not like a point in a discussion, well tough.

sorry if you want to bring this into a Euro/USA bashing I dont.

The point to my post was to say how the Muslim countries feel, not how I personally feel. I dont care about the existance of Israel one way or the other.

Lets not continue this, (I think you are off, you think I am - lets leave it)

I dont need Foul and Offensive language to discuss a point.

I dont agree with what happened to the USA. All i wanted to get across was that this is just the first in a series of events that may happen. The fact is that if you kill 100 innocent civillians in Afghanistan, you are adding perhaps 2000 young men who are related. Thake these 2000 people and asume 10 percent are willing to kill others in revenge. That is 200 potential suicide bombers/Anthrax carriers/ebola or whatever (perhaps only 1 percent become one, you get the idea....)

The philosophy of the Afghans approve of, even encourage this, if the killer is a non Muslim (as I understand it).

The fact that the attack worked could also bring any terrorist organisation with a grudge against the USA to implement a terror campaign (who is to say that the Anthrax is from Bin Laden? - its not that organisations style....)

Take care
RedRed

[Joel]

Why can't some of y'all get it through your heads that this is not just about the US?

NAIROBI, Kenya (AP) - White powder in a letter mailed from Atlanta to a Kenyan has tested positive for anthrax spores, the health minister said Thursday, apparently the first case of tainted mail outside the United States since the Sept. 11 attacks.

Health Minister Sam Ongeri told a news conference that the unidentified recipient, a doctor who lives in Nairobi, and four family members "may have come into contact" with the spores and were being tested, but they are "not in danger." The powder was undergoing further tests at a government lab, he said.

It was unclear whether U.S. investigators had asked to be involved in the Kenyan cases, though Ongeri said his department was "perfectly capable" of handling the situation itself.

White powder was found in two other letters - one to an official with the U.N. Environment Program in Nairobi and the other to a Kenyan businessman in the central town of Nyeri, Ongeri said. Those letters were also being tested at the state-run Kenya Medical Research Institute, he said.

The letter that tested positive for anthrax had been mailed Sept. 8 from Atlanta, Ongeri said, and was received in Kenya on Oct. 9. It was opened on Oct. 11.

The hand-addressed letter to the U.N. official was mailed from Pakistan, and the letter to the businessman appeared to have been mailed from Nairobi, he said.

Joel