Digital 8 vs. Digital

[dchip]

Grigory: I often forget that describing video connections is a bit like describing computer hardware configurations and one must be very specific. Earlier, when I was talking about my TV I should have said 525 horizontal lines of resolution. Thanks for pointing that out. This was a higher priced Panasonic TV with better picture (more lines), amp, etc. Its dual-tuner PIP and I connect my camcorder to it with S-video in. Actually, the Canon Elura is the first video input device I have owned that really shows what the TV can do and I attribute that to what the Elura can send. One of these days I hope to get a chance to compare my Elura to a 3CCD unit. I can't make any supported claims right now but my gut feeling tells me the optics and RGB filtering on this thing will compare nicely to 3CCD's.

[Patrick]

Chris, I stayed out of the discussion up to this point for two reasons. First, there's only so many times that I can reiterate the same information. The second reason is because I was in the midst of getting my new camcorder. And after everything I've stated about the benefits of Digital8, what did I get? Well, today I picked up a brand new Sony DCR-TRV900 MiniDV camcorder! I know, I know, I feel so dirty.

So why did I join the enemy camp? Well, as much as I still maintain that Digital8 is a viable digital format, if money is NO object, then MiniDV has more to offer. No, I'm not wealthy, but as I reported in another thread, my house was broken into and the insurance company has been more than fair with me. The camcorder (Sony CCD-V801 Hi8) which was stolen in the break in had manual overrides for EVERY function (shutter speed, iris, gain, white balance, etc), so I insisted with my insurance agent that I wanted a replacement camcorder that had all these features. There are only two current choices made by Sony that fill the bill- the TRV-900 and the brand new (and more expensive) VX-2000 . The added bonus is that both of these MiniDV camcorders have 3 CCDs and optical image stabilization. I never even considered a Canon because they've moved their warranty repair depot outside of the province. And even though I sometimes get very upset with Sony, I've used their video products for the last ten years, so I feel sort of an allegiance to them.

Although I have a huge library of Hi8 tapes, I still have my EV-S3000 Hi8 deck to play them back with. Having this Hi8 deck made the decision not to get a Digital8 camcorder that much easier. I totally agree with what has been said here already about the optics of Digital8 being more than sufficient for most people. Plus I doubt that they are much inferior, if at all, to the optics of MiniDV camcorders within the same price range.

dizzynoodle, the Sony TRV20 camcorder does not have 3 CCDs, it has one.

Grigory, hello my friend, nice to see you at the forum again. I hope you will still "talk" with me now that I've turned traitor and have acquired a MiniDV camcorder.

[dchip]

Congrats Patrick. You got a good one, plus, you can still be a D8 defender while quietly getting that professional quality video with your new Sony mini dv . I think it is jeffb who also owns one of those along with many others here I am sure. The Zeiss optics along with the 3CCD's, optical stabilization, etc. will make for some superb video.

[Patrick]

Thanks dchip. Now I'm debating whether to continue to try and master the RR-S, or if I'll just get a DV card like the Pyro for my computer. If I go that route though, I'll have to "hack" the TRV900 so that it will allow "real time" signal conversion from analog to digital. (I wonder if Jeff has done this?) I still have a lot of analog Hi8 tapes I want to edit. Always so many decisions to make...

Just a side note, I was kinda surprised that Sony didn't even include a MiniDV tape with this $3500(Cdn) camcorder. I guess that would've cut into their profit margin.

[Flying dutchman]

Elie,

you're forgetting VHS-C and SVHS-C in your list. The quality of VHS-C is comparable to 8mm, and S-VHS-C is comparable to Hi-8.

I still own a SVHS-C camera (beside my Canon Optura/MV30 DV) and the image quality is very good.

BTW, this month I bought a couple of DV tapes in a German shop (Basf, 60 minutes, the new "optimized for LP" quality) for $7 (DM 12.99) apiece. I believe there's Panasonic material inside.

[Brian Ellis]

Patrick

Welcome into the club! You won't regret it, I'm sure.


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Brian (the terrible)

PS Please post your full address so that we can kick your back door down and renew our equipment.

[This message has been edited by Brian Ellis (edited 30 August 2000).]

[Railie]

And what about "Panasonic NV-DS 8" ?
Is this cheap MiniDV comparable with D8?

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Railie

[Elie]

Hey Dutchman,
Sorry for not including VHS-C and SVHS-C in my list, totally forgot about the format
The only thing I didn't like about them was the tape length..30 minutes or 40 minutes max?
I understand you have the Canon Optura, HOW IS IT???
Quality and everything?

Thanks,
Elie

[VIKINGMAN]

Rallie - No, the Pana NV-DS 8 is NOT compatible with the D8-format. It's just a simple product model-number.

Pooh - You're saying: "the D8 is plenty good enough". What I'd like to know, is what you mean by that. Here in Denmark the DV-cams has now been cheaper than D8-cams for over 6 month, so why pay more.....for less???

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ASUS P2B-S, PIII-550 (o/c to 565MHz), 384MB RAM, Cheetah 9.1 GB, Matrox Mill. G200SG, SB 64AWE, Plextor 32x CD-Rom, PlexWriter PX-R820T CD-R, Canon BJC-7000 InkJet, OkiPage 4W Laser and Canon CanoScan 300 Scanner.

[Patrick]

Brian, I'm sure that you have a lot more interesting stuff in your house than I have in mine. So if you could just let everyone know when you expect to be out of the country again, the "boys" will be right over.

[dizzynoodle]

hey guys, startin' to get a long thread there !
Can someone clarify whether the Marvel 400 outputs nearly all types of codec video ?! like the Max version ? Basically what i need to do which i can't very well at this point with a Marvel 200, is to capture edit and dump on tape [without being bound to rendring final output to Mjpeg [matrox] so will the Marvel 400 allow me to do that ? since i will also need to by a separate DV-IN card since the Marvels don't have that.

[VIKINGMAN]

Dizzynoodle!

What you need isn't a G400 Marvel but a RT2000!

The only way you can output directly to tape (to some extent) is by getting hardware rendering aka the RT2000.

Also, the editing quality is better / higher resolution. The RT2000 also has a build-in FireWire DV-IN/-OUT!

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ASUS P2B-S, PIII-550 (o/c to 565MHz), 384MB RAM, Cheetah 9.1 GB, Matrox Mill. G200SG, SB 64AWE, Plextor 32x CD-Rom, PlexWriter PX-R820T CD-R, Canon BJC-7000 InkJet, OkiPage 4W Laser and Canon CanoScan 300 Scanner.

[This message has been edited by VIKINGMAN (edited 01 September 2000).]

[Sillyname]

dizzynoodle? Woo Hoo! If you have a digital cam, keep your video in DV format by buying a 1394 card. Edit in DV and output back to your camera. From there you can transfer it to any medium. That would then give you an option that is of better quality than the RR-G.

Your DV cam, if you have one, compresses the video 5:1 on the fly to tape. To buy something that has a better compression ratio than your source material is a bit ridiculous, if you ask me...

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Deep is not the root word of depression.

[Grigory]

Hi!

Basically, it is possible to output DV format video with software decoder right out from G400 TV connector. Canopus codec can do this in realtime. However, the field otder of G400 dual head is not adjustable and is inversed. Although it is still possible to prepare movie to play correctly, it might only be interesting if your camcorder does not have DV input. With all units that have Dv in it is much more convenient and reliable to use camcorder as DV to analog converter.

Patric ) ,
Congratulations with a happy final of not too good happening!
Concerning D8, I can say that until somebody shows me that the tape/electronics/hardware codec in D8 units is worse than in low end mini-DV, i'll continue to say that these models have future.

At least I can use it as tape storage device after I can find somebody who let me own 3CCD digital camcorder...


Best regards,
Grigory

[dizzynoodle]

thanx guys,

sillyname; while that is valid for material captured fom the Dv cam, will the quality be as good for material captured from elsewhere ? [i'm refering to dumping back onto DV cam before outputing to tape ...etc.