Water cooling for the masses.

[Jammrock]

Cooler Master has released the coolest CPU cooler of all time! It's called the Aquagate Mini!



The pump, resevior, and CPU water block are all integrated into a single piece that mounts on to the CPU. All the tubing is factory sealed with anti-icing fluid already inside (2-year gaurntee before refilling). The radiator attaches to your 80 or 120 mm fan intake or exhaust in your case, and tubing is long enough for a front or rear mount. The radiator fan has three speed settings for quiet or high performance/overclocking performance.

Reviews I've read say the water cooler drops CPU temps from 10-20 C, depending on ambient temp and CPU load, versus any air cooler.

And the 120 mm radiator/fan version only runs $100!

I love it!

Water cooling for the masses!

I know what's going to cool my next PC

Jammrock

[Dr Mordrid]

I think this one is destined for at the very least my main rig as well.

Pity I'll have to lose the fan with the pretty lights, but such is life.

Dr. Mordrid

[Nowhere]

What for...I have soundless cooling already (uhmm...especially since it wasn't on for over half a year ), and processors from now on will consume less power.

[borat]

What for...I have soundless cooling already (uhmm...especially since it wasn't on for over half a year ), and processors from now on will consume less power.

"Reviews I've read say the water cooler drops CPU temps from 10-20 C"

there is your answer - lower temps for the same fan speed. Which means you can run real quiet mode, or overclock the balls off it mode, and be cooler in both cases - you may not feel the need to spend >$100 on a heatsink/fan, but there are pleanty out there who want watercooling without the hassle it brings, and i am one of them. I'm pretty convinced its heat thats holding me back from taking my barton above 2.4 - 2.5gig at the moment, this product would help.

[Nowhere]

My cooler is already inaudible (yes, totally) at default CPU speed, and the temp is below 40 degrees C. Future CPU's will only do better at that (besides there's nothing wrong in, say, 55 degrees). And why would you spend >100$ more on watercooling system, when you can spend it simply on faster cpu, working at high speed at default voltage? That's what I call less hassle - you buy it, plug it, and it works at desired speed. This system still brings typicall watercooling hassle, albeit not so much of it - there's this " (2-year gaurntee before refilling)" line after all.

[GT98]

Only problem is that you can get the same cooling effects from a cheaper, but noiser air cooled CPU cooler.

I have the Aquagate unit that takes up two 5 1/4 bays and its pretty nice...though I'm losing liquid from it some where...I get an alarm that its low every 2 months or so..but no signs of leaks from the outside the unit. I'll have to pull it out one day and take a look see.

[Nowhere]

Yeah...potentiall leaks...more hassle-free goodness...

[borat]

My cooler is already inaudible (yes, totally) at default CPU speed, and the temp is below 40 degrees C. Future CPU's will only do better at that (besides there's nothing wrong in, say, 55 degrees). And why would you spend >100$ more on watercooling system, when you can spend it simply on faster cpu, working at high speed at default voltage? That's what I call less hassle - you buy it, plug it, and it works at desired speed. This system still brings typicall watercooling hassle, albeit not so much of it - there's this " (2-year gaurntee before refilling)" line after all.

If your happy with the set up you have then that is great - i dont see what your issue is with people liking this product.
this thing is definately going to cool your processor down better than a standard non waterbased approach - period.
the real appeal is that it's packaged up as a plug and go solution, water cooling has never been quite so neat or easy in the past. I personally congratualate coolermaster for trying to bring an innovative product to market.

[Nowhere]

It's just that...what for? Why more complicated and error-prone way of achieving the same effect? Why you need to cool your cpu better to overclock it? (take the price of cpu+cooling+more likely malfunction before answering) Especially since now Intel also goes the way of cool & low power. Or perhaps you like the old ways?
Neat and easy...they better have damn good quality control, water and electronics don't come nicely together. I personally congratulate coolermaster for riding on one more geek delusion...not. BTW, Apple teaming with car radiator manufacturer and producing watercooling that's just one package attached just to mobo (not mobo + case) was innovative. But this?

And I didn't forbid anyone form buying this thing.

[Jammrock]

It's just that...what for?

Overclocking.

Why more complicated and error-prone way

You have missed the whole point of the Aquagate Mini ... to uncomplicate using water cooling. And all systems are error prone. The question is what are the chances of a catastrophic error occuring? True, a water cooled system has a higher margin for error, but to system tweakers it is worth the risk. Well, for system tweakers like me. Plus, with factory sealed tubing it lessens, assuming good QA, the chance of catastrophic error.

... of achieving the same effect?

Incorrect. The result is that the water cooled CPU runs at a lower temperature Now this won't mean much to most people, but to overclockers it makes a world of difference.

Why you need to cool your cpu better to overclock it?

Yes, it's a proven fact that the cooler the cooler the CPU the better the overclock. To a point. The ideal temp for a microchip is -40 C. The closer you are to -40 C the faster your CPU can run.

(take the price of cpu+cooling+more likely malfunction before answering)

Okay ... Athlon 64 X2 3800+ ($380) + Aquagate Mini R120 ($100) = $480. Overclockers have reported that it is easy to push a 3800+ (natively at 2 GHz) to 2.7 GHz with or without water cooling with relative ease. Water cooling will just give you the extra advantage of stability and possibly higher speed. The closest retail CPU to 2.7 GHz in the AMD X2 line (manchester core) is the X2 4600+ which runs at 2.4 GHz and costs $690. So even if you can only reach 2.4 GHz with a water-cooled X2 3800+, you still save $210 over a retail X2 4600+. As for chance to malfunction ... it's worth the risk in my book, but that's just me.

Especially since now Intel also goes the way of cool & low power.

Those CPUs won't be out until late 2006. Before the prices come down to sane levels, 2007 at the earliest for most of us. Sorry, not going to wait that long.

Or perhaps you like the old ways?

The "old way is currently the only way.

Neat and easy...they better have damn good quality control, water and electronics don't come nicely together.

That's the hope. So far I haven't seen any problems mentioned online.

I personally congratulate coolermaster for riding on one more geek delusion...not.

Just because you're delusional into thinking that a good overclock isn't worth it, then more power to you! But for me, I'm gonna overclock the hell out of an X2 3800+ with a water cooler and squeeze every watt of power I can out of that damn thing.

BTW, Apple teaming with car radiator manufacturer and producing watercooling that's just one package attached just to mobo (not mobo + case) was innovative.

If you insist...

But this?

Water cooling for the masses ... sounds pretty innovative to me.

And I didn't forbid anyone form buying this thing.

No, you just ridiculed the idea to the point that your comments insinuated that anyone who buys a water cooler is an idiot. Which is pretty much the same thing, just a different way of doing it.

Jammrock

[Nowhere]

Overclocking.

The point is: I can have completelly silent air-based solution for a little less than 15$. Can someone guarantee that you'll overclock to the point that you'll have better CPU than the one that costs 85$ more? Not to mention that it means you're running out of spec/higher voltage/less guarantee that it won't fail and all that details...

You have missed the whole point of the Aquagate Mini ... to uncomplicate using water cooling. And all systems are error prone. The question is what are the chances of a catastrophic error occuring? True, a water cooled system has a higher margin for error, but to system tweakers it is worth the risk. Well, for system tweakers like me. Plus, with factory sealed tubing it lessens, assuming good QA, the chance of catastrophic error.

Still - much more complicated than air cooling, and you know what Murphy thinks about that. QA - I mentioned that it would be better for Coolermaster if it was top notch...but nobody can guarantee that yet, it's just assumption. Also I'd say that the chances of catastrophic error of such relativelly complicated system that is completelly assembled at all times are actually larger in transport and during assembly in the computer (but of course in most cases they should be easily spotted). To sum it up - higher risk of defect during transport etc., and I think very comparable during operation.

Incorrect. The result is that the water cooled CPU runs at a lower temperature Now this won't mean much to most people, but to overclockers it makes a world of difference.

You know by now that I'm looking at the whole picture, right?

Yes, it's a proven fact that the cooler the cooler the CPU the better the overclock. To a point. The ideal temp for a microchip is -40 C. The closer you are to -40 C the faster your CPU can run.

I wasn't clear enough there... Of course I know those facts, the thing is: why at all pay much more for cooling to overclock when you can simply buy faster cpu? (and no surprises here - although I imagine some people want them )

Okay ... Athlon 64 X2 3800+ ($380) + Aquagate Mini R120 ($100) = $480. Overclockers have reported that it is easy to push a 3800+ (natively at 2 GHz) to 2.7 GHz with water cooling with relative ease. The closest retail CPU to 2.7 GHz in the AMD X2 line is the X2 4600+ which runs at 2.4 GHz and costs $690. So even if you can only reach 2.4 GHz with a water-cooled X2 3800+, you still save $210 over a retail X2 4600+. As for chance to malfunction ... it's worth the risk in my book, but that's just me.

I see you've answered to my first three questions in this post. Well, we're in a different worlds then Paying 400$ for a cpu? You must be insane!
As for chance to malfunction ... it's not worth the risk in my book, especially with such pricey cpu, but that's just me.

Those CPUs won't be out until late 2006. Before the prices come down to sane levels, 2007 at the earliest for most of us. Sorry, not going to wait that long.
...
The "old way is currently the only way.

So in the meantime it's good to burn watts...yeah, perhaps I'm alone with thinking that it's not worth it. And you know, AMD is acceptable right now...

That's the hope. So far I haven't seen any problems mentioned online.

Hope...powerfull thing that is (damn, what was the line about it? Hmm...not sure even if it exist in ENG...)

Just because you're delusional into thinking that a good overclock isn't worth it, then more power to you! But for me, I'm gonna overclock the hell out of an X2 3800+ with a water cooler and squeeze every watt of power I can out of that damn thing.

Why? Really, why? Windows isn't snappy enough? Webpages are slow? Games, that are limited today mostly by GPU anyway, work to slow at those 100fps?
The only good thing this would bring would be faster video encoding & compiling...but only if made often...

Water cooling for the masses ... sounds pretty innovative to me.
...
No, you just ridiculed the idea to the point that your comments insinuated that anyone who buys a water cooler is an idiot. Which is pretty much the same thing, just a different way of doing it.

Jammrock

Decide if you're talking about masses or enthusiasts.
Ridiculed? Idiot? (perhaps you have this impression from borats overinterpratation that I somehow have "issues" with "people liking this") I just gave valid, I think, doubts over whole idea. You're the one who've said that they've ridiculed it

[borat]

just to clear things up here - i dont think you have issue with anyone, im just curious as to why you think that this product will not appeal to some people.

Your correct in that half of the appeal with overclocking is the 'sport' , it gives pleasure to an enthusiast to tweak every last drop out of their system, much like car lovers fitting air filters and high flow exhausts to their automobiles.

think its time to agree to disagree - though the line by line disections do remind me of more active times on here in a good way.

The main thing is we are all friends

[Jammrock]

The point is: I can have completelly silent air-based solution for a little less than 15$. Can someone guarantee that you'll overclock to the point that you'll have better CPU than the one that costs 85$ more? Not to mention that it means you're running out of spec/higher voltage/less guarantee that it won't fail and all that details...

If there is a fan attached to the heatsink, which you have unless you're running something slower than a Pentium processor, your CPU cooler is NOT silent. It is scientifically impossible. It may be inaudible - you should have stuck with that word - because the noise is either drowned out by another component in your computer, or because the case is well insulated and is inaudible at the distance you are sitting away from your computer. Or for any number of other reasons, but not silent. So in sum ... silent, no ... inaudible for an afore mentioned reason ... probably.

Still - much more complicated than air cooling, and you know what Murphy thinks about that. QA - I mentioned that it would be better for Coolermaster if it was top notch...but nobody can guarantee that yet, it's just assumption. Also I'd say that the chances of catastrophic error of such relativelly complicated system that is completelly assembled at all times are actually larger in transport and during assembly in the computer (but of course in most cases they should be easily spotted). To sum it up - higher risk of defect during transport etc., and I think very comparable during operation.

Murphy is a good friend of mine. We are on a first name basis. His first name is Larry, by the way. Just be cause it is more complicated that sticking a slab of metal on a CPU and putting a fan on it does not mean it must be faulty. You seem to be one of those "cup i s half empty" guys. Do you honestly think they would release a water cooling solution design for "the masses" and "ease of use" if they hadn't thought up of a secure manufaturing, shipping, and installation method. Do you realize that they would be liable for damages caused to a computer if their product failed? I know, because I've held 2 different companies resposible to damages done to my computer due to faulty parts.

Now think about this ... if Cooler Master is liable, and they are, if their product is faulty, and they are marketing it to the masses ... don't you think their QA would be a pretty high priority? Plus, I have researched this thing already ... their QA is pretty top notch so far. But if you want to be Mr. Naysayer, go right on ahead.

Plus, Cooler Master is a top notch company that does make top notch stuff...

You know by now that I'm looking at the whole picture, right?

The whole picture says that there are hundreds of ways to be killed when you walk out the door and leave your house. So according to the whole picture you should never leave your house, right?

I wasn't clear enough there... Of course I know those facts, the thing is: why at all pay much more for cooling to overclock when you can simply buy faster cpu? (and no surprises here - although I imagine some people want them )

Uh ... because I can overclock a 3800+ and get 4600+/4800+ performance, saving me $210 to $300 that I can use on other things. And for budget limited people like me (somehow my wife thinks paying the mortgage, the car, and feeding the kids is a higher priority than building a $5000 computer) that's how we do things.

I see you've answered to my first three questions in this post. Well, we're in a different worlds then Paying 400$ for a cpu? You must be insane!
As for chance to malfunction ... it's not worth the risk in my book, especially with such pricey cpu, but that's just me.

This will be my only shot at building a computer for at least 3 years (unless I win the lottery, and since I don't play the lottery, the chances are thinner than normal), so I need to build the best system my budget can afford to last me three years. In the next three years all single core CPUs will go away, and nearly every major OS, game, and app will be designed to take advantage of multi-core CPUs. So if I want to build a computer to not fall off the performance curve until my next upgrade in 3-years, then I need a dual core CPU ... and the 3800+ is my best option.

So in the meantime it's good to burn watts...yeah, perhaps I'm alone with thinking that it's not worth it. And you know, AMD is acceptable right now...

An overclocked X2 still produces less watts than a Pentium D. You could warm up a cast iron pot enough to boil water those things run so hot. So once again, X2 is my best option. Overclocking is the most cost effective option. The Aquagate is the best, and least expensive, option for water cooling for me who doesn't want to hassle. SOunds acceptable until the low watt CPUs hit in 1.5 years, and 2-3 years for the masses ... which is magically my next upgrade time

Hope...powerfull thing that is (damn, what was the line about it? Hmm...not sure even if it exist in ENG...)

Sounds okay in Engrish. Hope is a powerful. Every day you hope your HDD doesn't fail. Every day you hope a massive power surge doesn't cook your PC. Every day you hope you don't lose your job (or whoever supports you doesn't lose thier job if you're still a young'n). Every day you hope that fan on your heatsink doesn't fail and cook your processor. Or that your power supply doesn't blow a rail and wipe out half your system... And do you really think I won't test the water cooler OUT of the system on a dummy PSU load BEFORE I put it in my new computer? I think not. You have no faith in my l33tn355.

Why? Really, why? Windows isn't snappy enough? Webpages are slow? Games, that are limited today mostly by GPU anyway, work to slow at those 100fps?
The only good thing this would bring would be faster video encoding & compiling...but only if made often...

See above. And yes I do a good deal of audio video editing.

Decide if you're talking about masses or enthusiasts.

Both. I have friends who are not enthusists who have water cooled systems. Water cooled systems are better. More chance for error, yes. But better at cooling the CPU, which allows people to overclock, and quiet down, and run those pesky hot CPUs without worry of thermal degridation ... etc.

Ridiculed? Idiot? (perhaps you have this impression from borats overinterpratation that I somehow have "issues" with "people liking this") I just gave valid, I think, doubts over whole idea. You're the one who've said that they've ridiculed it

You're concerns are valid. The methods you use to present your opinion are ridicule. This may be a language barrier (don't know what your native tongue is), or your writing style, but it comes across as the most idiotic thing enyone ever thought of and anyone that buys one is an even bigger idiot. Just the way it reads to me.

Anyway, it's late and I need some sleep before the baby wakes me up at 03:30 and wants food. Let's just agree that the idea to agree to disagree is the best option for this debate. You will more than likely never own a liquid cooled system, and I will more than likely own one in the next 6 months. Happiness abounds.

Good night.

Jammrock

[Nowhere]

No borat, it's more like this product won't (shouldn't?) appeal to most of people...
Perhaps it's just that I think it's dead end of evolution: more energy output and solutions to effectivelly deal with it. So why pump more money into such systems? Why make them (you know, them ) think it wasn't such a bad idea after all, by voting with your wallet...yeah, perhaps that's the root of "it shouldn't"...

Sport...yeah, the disagreement might also come from my shift of interest some...or perhaps long time ago; basically: hardware doesn't matter, as long as it doesn't get in the way of doing some cool/innovative/usefull/good things with software.


@Jammrock:
You know very well that I used the subjective meaning of "silent"...after all that's all that matters: if you can't hear it, it's silent. And my fan is silent for other reason then the ones you've mentioned: at ~1200rpm, someone would have to try to make it audible. I'll just say that my computer is right by the head of my rommate and his wife when they sleep in our room...no problem for them at all.
And BTW, smaller version uses 80mm fan, and the amount of heat it has to dissipate is actually a little bit larger (ok, in a totally negligible way...but stil ). Now, it also depends from dissipation area of course, but it might be actually louder. edit: w8, we have the data on the site after all Well, I can definatelly say that 80mm 1800rpm min fan will probably be louder than 120mm 1200rpm min. (do both versions retail at the same price? that would be unusual...but quite neat; but one problem here: cases that have space for 120mm fans are more expensive! )

As for Murphy...nah, I'm more like "form over function-not!" guy (be adviced: ENG and PL versions of this absolutelly can't be called identicall in meaning; if you want I can ask my friend, student of English philology, for more proper translation)

Whole picture...oh please, don't forget what we're discussing...

But next thing blew me away a little...

"Budget limited people"? You know you're kidding yourself, right? Budget limited people don't buy one of top of the line cpu's, they buy the cheapest with rather full feature set and that will be fast enough, with the hope to cheaply upgrade to higher model later in time. They don't risk with the hardware they have, because if it fails they won't have any. So that also means they won't mess with water. And your budget for CPU alone will be around their whole...
Yeah, different worlds perhaps...with your lower class at the level of our lower middle class... (let me guess...mortgage for a house? A house...budget limited people... :shakes head: )
Main point: IMHO you're fooling yourself a little if you say it's because the lack of money... (but probably I'm speaking all of this in completelly different (for example: relative vs. absolute, although it's more complicated than that) context that you'll understand it, so perhaps it'll be better if we'll just forget the thing...)

OK, in the next three years...so "why now" would be again question from world far, far away...

As for your next point, 1337ness ...so...it isn't for the masses after all?
And why better if "only" better at cooling? That's some kind of holy grail or something?

Another thought...perhaps I'm also "if it works, and works as it should...why make it better?" (some version of "if it works don't fix it" probably...)

Oh, and as for impressions: I think they're mostly from the thing that text is rather limited medium, if one doesn't use some peotic acrobations to express thiughts...and boy, that would look funny in this type of discussion

[Sasq]

all I can say is...
Nowhere, you have never been married have you.