Water cooling for the masses.

[Nowhere]

Here that would mean I've stopped planning any upgrades completelly ...eventually buying only what's absolutelly and unquestionably needed...

[Sasq]

drop the 'here' and you have a vague idea.

[Nowhere]

Sooo...on which side are you?

[Jammrock]

@Jammrock:
You know very well that I used the subjective meaning of "silent"...after all that's all that matters: if you can't hear it, it's silent. And my fan is silent for other reason then the ones you've mentioned: at ~1200rpm, someone would have to try to make it audible. I'll just say that my computer is right by the head of my rommate and his wife when they sleep in our room...no problem for them at all.

I know, I just like nit picking on occasion

[quote]And BTW, smaller version uses 80mm fan, and the amount of heat it has to dissipate is actually a little bit larger (ok, in a totally negligible way...but stil ). Now, it also depends from dissipation area of course, but it might be actually louder. edit: w8, we have the data on the site after all Well, I can definatelly say that 80mm 1800rpm min fan will probably be louder than 120mm 1200rpm min. (do both versions retail at the same price? that would be unusual...but quite neat; but one problem here: cases that have space for 120mm fans are more expensive! )[/quote[
The amount of heat is the same. The difference is that the 80 mm version has less radiator room to dissipate the heat, which means it simply doesn't do it as efficiently

I can get a Cooler Master Centurion 5 case, with a 120 mm fan bracket in the rear of the case, for $50 USD (sans power, but I'd never use integrated power). I've recommended that case to several people and it is a wonderful case. I will probably end up with that one myself. Form, function, ease of use, plenty of expansion space, and a damn good price.

As for Murphy...nah, I'm more like "form over function-not!" guy (be adviced: ENG and PL versions of this absolutelly can't be called identicall in meaning; if you want I can ask my friend, student of English philology, for more proper translation)

Whole picture...oh please, don't forget what we're discussing...

Difference of opinion. Water cooling is not a new technology. It is not unproven. If done wrong the results can be catastrophically bad. Done correctly and the results are astoundingly good. The question is do you trust COoler Master to make a quality part that has good QA. I, and several others, say "yes." You and ... uh ... so far nobody else, say "I don't care who makes it, nothing with water in it is going inside my system." Difference of opinion ... you are just overly passionate about it ...

But next thing blew me away a little...

"Budget limited people"? You know you're kidding yourself, right? Budget limited people don't buy one of top of the line cpu's, they buy the cheapest with rather full feature set and that will be fast enough, with the hope to cheaply upgrade to higher model later in time. They don't risk with the hardware they have, because if it fails they won't have any. So that also means they won't mess with water. And your budget for CPU alone will be around their whole...

"Budget limited people" does not equal "poor people." I am not poor. My wife and I simply decide to spend or save most of our money on other things. If we weren't so budget minded I would probably build a $2500+ computer. As it is, I am limiting myself (notice the "I" part) to $1000, which a respectable amount for a good new computer. For $1000 I can get the lowest end X2, an inexpensive water cooler, and get 4600+ performance out of it. However, if I were to simply buy a 4600+ processor, that would take up nearly 70% of my budget, leaving my hardly any money for other things.

If I were "poor," I would go out an buy a $300-$500 Dell special and call it a day...if I could even afford that.

Thus the difference between "budget limited" and "poor".

Yeah, different worlds perhaps...with your lower class at the level of our lower middle class... (let me guess...mortgage for a house? A house...budget limited people... :shakes head: )

See above.

Main point: IMHO you're fooling yourself a little if you say it's because the lack of money... (but probably I'm speaking all of this in completelly different (for example: relative vs. absolute, although it's more complicated than that) context that you'll understand it, so perhaps it'll be better if we'll just forget the thing...)

See above.

OK, in the next three years...so "why now" would be again question from world far, far away...

My primary HDD is on the verge of crashing (5-years old and you can hear the berrings going out). My secondary HDD is nearly 4-years old and more than likely won't make it another 3-years. I'm out of expansion slots. My case is a decade old and weighs 40 lbs (about 18 kg). My video card can no longer play modern video games (FEAR won't run even with all the eye candy turned off and the res set to 640x480). My power supply puts out about 50 db by itself (this computer was built over a year before the silent movement hit the computer world). And now that my wife, and soon son, use my computer I am forced to have a virus scanner and antispyware scanner running at all times. Plus I usually have two users logged in to WinXP. The current CPU and amount of RAM are having difficulties keeping the system runing fast. Tag on I can't play modern games with my system because the CPU (an Athlon XP 1900+) is typically the "minimum" for games, and you have a good reason to upgrade now, and not in 3 more year. FYI, my computer is 3-6 years old for internal parts (case is 10). It won't last until low Watt CPUs hit the masses.

As for your next point, 1337ness ...so...it isn't for the masses after all?

L33tn355 means I know what the #$@* I'm doing. The cooler is designed so Joe Blow can install and use it. Someone like me can turn it into something more than a cool looking CPU cooler, and make sure it doesn't cook my computer if there is something wrong with it.

And why better if "only" better at cooling? That's some kind of holy grail or something?

It's not just better, it is significantly better. 10-20 C less than even the high-end air CPU coolers ... that's a HUGE difference. If you don't understand why that's siginifcant, then you are beyond my help to understand it...

Another thought...perhaps I'm also "if it works, and works as it should...why make it better?" (some version of "if it works don't fix it" probably...)

The English phrase you are looking for, "if it ain't broke, don't fix it." The problem is that air cooling is reaching it's limits on what it can and can't cool. All the new processors have heatpiped coolers to augment cooling, because a normal heatsink and fan can't cut it any more. True, when the low watt processors hit they will be okay again, but they're not out yet now are they?

Oh, and as for impressions: I think they're mostly from the thing that text is rather limited medium, if one doesn't use some peotic acrobations to express thiughts...and boy, that would look funny in this type of discussion

Lost you there.

Jammrock

[Goc]

I think it's a great product that will sell like hot cakes...
It can't fail because it's a great solution for two very different kinds of computer users:
a) ones like Jammrock here that know what they are doing and want to have as much muscle as they can, for lowest price possible,
and b) FPS-kiddies with flashing neon lights that don't have a clue about computers but enjoy going to a LAN party and saying: "Yo dud3! Ch3ck dis out! It's wata-kooled!111!!"

Personally, I'd kill for exactly that kind of cooler. Try air cooling two mobile bartons working at 2360 Mhz that are confined to a 20x20 cm square with graphic card pumping in heat from the bottom along with all other components in the case. Despite me having 5x80mm intake, and 2x80, 1x92 and 1x120mm exhaust fans, my CPU's run around 60-62°C because I simply can't get enough cold air to them without some serious ducting. With two of those coolers I would also be able to get them up to 2600 Mhz because they work at that speed in a single setup with beefier cooling. If I would get them up to those speeds, with the ongoing multithreading revolution going on, I think my current setup could last me at least another 3 years. OK, I'm not that far off right now with 2x2360, but it wouldn't be so loud because I would kick out few of those intake/exhaust fans...

Heh, enough ranting...

[UtwigMU]

Goc, your temps are high:

My mobiles @2.26 are 55 year, 62 summer (full load, 5-6°C idle) with 3 lowest setting on PSU fan only intakes, 2 1800RPM exhausts, 1 92 1400RPM side and 2500 RPM CPU fans. After going mobiles the rig is quieter than average single CPU rig and quieter than ambient noise of main street 100m away with open window.

Otherwise, my take on water cooling - when more integrated, safer/easier to use watter coolers will trickle to enthusiasts and midrange (Intel's BTX modules were a step towards this direction), they will certainly become interesting. Otherwise high end air cooling vs lowend wattercooling, you do get lower temps (noise with large fans over heatsinks or radiators is similar), which can help with overclock.

[Claymonkey]

I have to say I'd be VERY interested in trying out a couple of these. I've been a hater of ANY noise in my computer since I ordered a heatsink with a delta fan years ago and then pulled it out a week later.

[Claymonkey]

Newegg has it for $89

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16835103164

looks like there is a 120mm model as well for $99:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16835103165

I'm sold... just need a paycheck

[GNEP]

http://www.silentpcreview.com/ all the way baby I've now had so many comments of "what do you mean your computers are on?" that I surely owe those guys a beer by now... Silence over power any day for me.

[Claymonkey]

You know I hate to admit it... but Dells are rather quiet. My last two jobs used the extensively and the ducting does a very good job of keeping them quiet.

GNEP - thanks for the link. I'll have to check that out.

[Goc]

@ Utwig

Goc, your temps are high:

My mobiles @2.26 are 55 year, 62 summer (full load, 5-6°C idle)

Heh... Since now is summer, I was talking about my summer temps. And those are full load temps, which means your temps are also high in that case. :P
I don't know my temps while idle. DAMN YOU BOINC!!!

[borat]

If anybody in the UK is after this product this is the cheapest i have found by about a tenner:
CoolerMaster AquaGate Mini R120 Liquid Cooling System : 50.47 INCL VAT!!! (42.95 ex VAT)

http://www.eclipsecomputers.com/product.aspx?code=HFC-AQUAMINI12

CoolerMaster AquaGate Mini R80 Liquid Cooling System : 49.29 INCL VAT (41.29 ex VAT)

http://www.eclipsecomputers.com/product.aspx?code=HFC-AQUAMINI8

parcel force next day is another 5.95 on top of that.

Its good to see something cost less in the UK than the USA at long last!

Just ordered mine up. Will post how it all goes and if it gives me any more speed from my barton.

[GuchiGuh]

w00t thats awesome!
*adds to shopping list for next computer

[borat]

If anybody in the UK is after this product this is the cheapest i have found by about a tenner:
CoolerMaster AquaGate Mini R120 Liquid Cooling System : 50.47 INCL VAT!!! (42.95 ex VAT)

http://www.eclipsecomputers.com/product.aspx?code=HFC-AQUAMINI12

CoolerMaster AquaGate Mini R80 Liquid Cooling System : 49.29 INCL VAT (41.29 ex VAT)

http://www.eclipsecomputers.com/product.aspx?code=HFC-AQUAMINI8

parcel force next day is another 5.95 on top of that.

Its good to see something cost less in the UK than the USA at long last!

Just ordered mine up. Will post how it all goes and if it gives me any more speed from my barton.

those prices are in GBP not $'s by the way - don't know how to get a pound sign with an american keyboard layout.

[dZeus]

set layout to US-International if not set to already.

Press right-alt + shift + 4