Some G400s are only AGP 2X??

[djroberts]

Bought a G400, I've been plesently suprised with it, except it's only AGP 2X. The advertisement said 2X-4X but it isn't. Are all the OEM cards 2X only?

- DJ

[Gurm]

Unless you have an advance shipment of a new Intel chipset, along with drivers to run it, how would you be able to tell the difference? Just a curious question.

- Gurm

P.S. What I'm implying is that your G400 _IS_ AGP 4x, but that you can't use it that fast since no motherboard currently in production can support AGP 4x.

[ALBPM]

DJ, that only works in 4X if you have a mother board that supports 4X. I don't know anyone with one of those yet.

Paul

[djroberts]

Matrox has been gracious enough to provide detailed info about the card in one of the properties/advanced screens. They also have a readme that states:

----------------------------------------
- Matrox AGP 2x and 4x cards

On the Matrox PowerDesk "Information" property sheet, Matrox G400-based
graphics cards are listed as "AGP 2x" or "AGP 2x-4x". All Matrox G400
graphics cards are slot-compatible with all AGP computers.
(However, cards with an ATX form factor will only fit on ATX-type
motherboards -- most cards and motherboards use an ATX design.)

"AGP 2x" cards use 2x mode with AGP 2x or 4x computers. "AGP 2x-4x"
cards use 4x mode with 4x computers, and 2x mode with 2x computers.

Because of new AGP specifications, Matrox G200-based AGP graphics cards
may not be slot-compatible with some AGP 4x computers.
-------------------------------------------
All the info below is attainable right where it tells you what you have. Mine says AGP 2x.

Thanks,
- DJ

[Gurm]

Yeah but that looks an awful lot like a string from the .inf file. Of course it could be these #$%*! OEM cards we have (I presume you have an OEM like me, since the retail boards just aren't out yet).

- Gurm

P.S. I don't know how the driver would tell you had an AGP 2x-4x, unless it could find an AGP 4x bus. That's all.

[Helevitia]

Intel has not released there new chipset that support AGP4X.

Dave

[Haig]

The G400 cards support 2x and 4x motherboards because of our universal connector. It will do 2x transactions in the 2x and 4x motherboards.

It isn't realistic for us to claim 4x transfer modes when nothing exists right now.

Also, unlike our competition, you do not have to jumper select between 2x and 4x voltages. We do this automatically.

Haig

[Buuri]

Haig, you've got to admid that the readme-file could have a better wording. Sounds too suspicious as it is..

Anyway, since Matrox is going around with 4x flags high I just have to be a little sceptical about that. Most of us remember how Matrox was going all 2x a year ago, and behold, practically no SS7 system was able to cope with it , and since 5.13 drivers have eliminated it on Asus P5A too, I wonder if it works on any SS7 board now. (G200 in 2x that is)

I wouldn't bet 4x works on any other chips than Intels.


B

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Excel 7.0, Winamp 2.23, Adobe Acrobat 4.0, QuickTime 4



[This message has been edited by Buuri (edited 07-07-99).]

[casket]

AGP 4x is a future proof feature...that you can't use yet. Intel's camino chipset was supposed to ship in June... So Nvidia and Matrox planned their products 6 months in advance to support AGP 4x. Camino chipset was delayed until November(this was also supposed to support ATA/66 for Hard Drives). Via, the new owners of Cyrix... are supposed to soon release a Via Apollo Pro Plus chipset, that will support PC133(necessary for AGP 4x), AGP 4x, and ATA/66. That's why intel revoked via's license, and via bought Cyrix...to get around it. Even AMD's Irongate(for Athlon) doesn't yet support AGP 4x.
I.e. don't worry about it.

[Buuri]

I'm aware of this, but what you said has my point in it. Don't hold your breath with G400 on your hand waiting for 4x. That G400 was designed and manufactored months before first 4x capable chipsets. Is there even a chance for it to work? At least with 2x Matrox failed at some respect.


B

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Excel 7.0, Winamp 2.23, Adobe Acrobat 4.0, QuickTime 4

[casket]

By the time Camino comes out, if it is this year at all(motherboard manufacturers says next year)... We may have a G800. Every 6 months, there's a new generation of Video Cards. Via will support AGP 4x first.

[Opus]

Buuri,
Unfortunatly any mobo chipset other than an Intel one (all SS7) has problems with 'new' implementations like AGP. It's been a fact of life for a while - compare and contrast the number of people with BX chipsets/AGP 2X complaints with SS7/AGP 2X complaints...

All peripheral manufaturers have to try and toe the Intel line. If Intel are late with Camino, what are thay going to do? Not design for it? Look at the current situation with ATA66 - there are a lot of new generation HDD's out there with this capability but have compatability probs, etc and users are complaining there is no current benefit. Duh! But people buy them cos when the new mobos come out they will be first in line for one.

All the manufaturers have to design their gear to Intel (and *sometimes* M$ ) spec.

Buuri, I know you're one of the most sceptical of the forum members and won't hold your breath for anything but in this case I think it's Intel or the SS7 manufacturers that deserves your AGP4X whinging as Matrox have implemented AGP 4X according to spec (but just haven't explained it well in that readme)

Cheers

[DrMordrid]

Not really. Most of the problems with AGP2x have been because of noise on the motherboard, not because of an inherent problem with the G200 boards.

Fairly large percentages of the mobos on the market have poor signal to noise ratios. This alone will cause the G200's (and a lot of other cards) to downshift into AGP1x in self defence.

I had this happen on some boards I tried for a friend who owns a local shop. All the SS7's but the FIC PA-2013 Rev. 2 MVP3 and one cheapo Gainward AladdinV (never can tell by price!) failed to go into AGP 2x.

All the quality BX boards (BH6, BX6, Tyan etc.) went into AGP 2x like a charm. The cheap BX boards, as well as the BX clones, failed.

One way to =kind of= predict this behavior is to look at the capacitors mounted around the slots. If they are smallish, like in an old transistor radio, then there may be a problem. The board is more likely to have a noisy bus. If they are large, robust looking things then you have a better chance.

Dr. Mordrid

[Buuri]

First, you say that G400 is designed buy the book so it's gonna work. How do you know G200 wasn't?

Second, other graphic adapters (TNT) seem to work fine on SS7 systems, so it is a Matrox specific problem. Not a problem of the mobo manufactorers.

Third, a word from *Matrox* goes that there's too much noise there wich prevents G200 work work properly. Do you think that there would be a day when they would say that some problem really was their own fault? It's easy to blame others to keep your own face, right?


B

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Excel 7.0, Winamp 2.23, Adobe Acrobat 4.0, QuickTime 4

[Opus]

Eh? Who is to say TNT is within spec? DrMordrid isn't speaking for Matrox, just from his own survey. And as for that bo**ocks about keeping face...

If Matrox's so bad Buuri why don't you buy a TNT then. Or have you pre-ordered a G400

Whatever... Getting bored with this one. Zzzzzzzzzzz.

[This message has been edited by Opus (edited 07-07-99).]