It's hard being a Matrox fan...

[Narayan]

It's hard being a Matrox fan, isn't it? I mean, you see all those new cards on the market sporting extraordinary performance figures and "revolutionary" technologies (TwinView, anyone?), and at the same time we, the core supporters of all things Matrox are stuck with the more-than-a-year-old G400 technology. Yeah sure we'll soon get the "G400 T&L" based cards (oops sorry I mean G450 :-) but it certainly isn't the technology leap we were expecting from Matrox, is it?
When the G400 was released last year, it blew away it's rivals at the time (TNT2, V3) performance-wise, whilst offering the visual quality we know and expect from a Matrox board. We know Matrox can lead the pack if they want to, so what's holding them up? I'm sick to the bone having every git with a GeForce SDR laughing at my face because I choose to support the company I've followed since the Mystique era, solely on a basis of TRUST for the product I will receive from them. Now I'm not sure I can trust Matrox enough to wait until the G800 is released, I mean who knows how well it will faire against the GeForce3 or the Voodoo6 or whatever.
Being hard pressed for an upgrade, I think I should go for a Voodoo5 for the time being (not much of a performer, but FSAA kicks ass - especially Nvidia's!). I'm sure I'm not the only fan Matrox has lost so far, and certainly not the last. Matrox may not have the mass of other graphics chip manufacturers, nor are they able to follow the six-month life cycle of graphics chips Nvidia has enforced on the consumer market, but they've got the cash (check out the U.S. campaign they're preparing for the G450 - eugh), they can shove it towards R&D instead of P.R. We know quality comes at a price and yes we're willing to pay more to get it, so what's the problem?
Sorry if I sound a bit bitter, it's hard making a transition after all these years...

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Currently powered by:
P3 600EB@700, Matrox G400 32MB DH, QDI Advance 9, 128MB PC133 Goldstar

[DataOrb]

think of it this way, if you would have bought a GeForce SDR card a while ago, after a mounth or so, you will see DDR Cards on the market, so you would feel bad that the "Latest and Best" video card you have is now taking a back seat to a new one. then when you buy a DDR card, 5 mounths later, a GeForce 2 GTS card comes along, one more, you are either Forced to upgrade, or live with a video card wich takes a "Back seat" the the "latest and best". not a good feeling is it?
once you decide to go out and buy a GeForce 2 card (After spending almost 1000$ on video cards in the past year (SDR+DDR+GF2)) Nvidia comes out with a new GeForce 2 MX Card, which is faster then a DDR When you Overclock it, but cost less then Half the price you paid, so how does that makes you feel? Knowing that NVIDIA could have soled you a card for so much less money half a year ago?
the Problem with NVIDIA 6 mounth Product Cycle is that you are some what FORCED to upgrade, unless you want to have a "Lesser" card... and beside, if a GeForce 2 MX Card when overclocked can give a GeForce 2 GTS card "somewhat" a run for it's money, and since you paid 250$ for your SDR board, only to have a faster SDR board avilable half a year later for 120$... well...
6 Mounth Product cycle DOES make sure the company have thier Latest and BEST card on the market, but also "Forcing" you to upgrade each time they have found a Memory that is 5Mhz faster, or slapped another pipeline to the core.
all of that = IMHO.


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"Excuse me for butting in, but I'm interrupt-driven..."
__________________________________________________ ____
Worstation Specs:
Asus P3B-F w/Celeron@680mhz
160mb PC100 7ns RAM.
Matrox G400 142/190Mhz.
IBM 75GXP 7200RPM 15Gb.
Seagate U8 4.1gb Hdd,
SBlaster Live! Digital.
17" Mag InnoVision 770Ti TrinitronFR Monitor @1152X864
Logitech MouseMan Wheel USB (on Everglide Giganta SE)
Focus 127keys MM Keyboard.
HP SCSI Cd-Rw 7200Si
Aopen X48 Optical Disc Drive.
3Com NIc @ Tevel/3Com Cable Modem
Modded case, the "banshee". 6 fans.
3Com Palm IIIx + GoType + AxxPAC

[DataOrb]

think of it this way, if you would have bought a GeForce SDR card a while ago, after a mounth or so, you will see DDR Cards on the market, so you would feel bad that the "Latest and Best" video card you have is now taking a back seat to a new one. then when you buy a DDR card, 5 mounths later, a GeForce 2 GTS card comes along, one more, you are either Forced to upgrade, or live with a video card wich takes a "Back seat" the the "latest and best". not a good feeling is it?
once you decide to go out and buy a GeForce 2 card (After spending almost 1000$ on video cards in the past year (SDR+DDR+GF2)) Nvidia comes out with a new GeForce 2 MX Card, which is faster then a DDR When you Overclock it, but cost less then Half the price you paid, so how does that makes you feel? Knowing that NVIDIA could have soled you a card for so much less money half a year ago?
the Problem with NVIDIA 6 mounth Product Cycle is that you are some what FORCED to upgrade, unless you want to have a "Lesser" card... and beside, if a GeForce 2 MX Card when overclocked can give a GeForce 2 GTS card "somewhat" a run for it's money, and since you paid 250$ for your SDR board, only to have a faster SDR board avilable half a year later for 120$... well...
6 Mounth Product cycle DOES make sure the company have thier Latest and BEST card on the market, but also "Forcing" you to upgrade each time they have found a Memory that is 5Mhz faster, or slapped another pipeline to the core.
all of that = IMHO.


------------------
"Excuse me for butting in, but I'm interrupt-driven..."
__________________________________________________ ____
Worstation Specs:
Asus P3B-F w/Celeron@680mhz
160mb PC100 7ns RAM.
Matrox G400 142/190Mhz.
IBM 75GXP 7200RPM 15Gb.
Seagate U8 4.1gb Hdd,
SBlaster Live! Digital.
17" Mag InnoVision 770Ti TrinitronFR Monitor @1152X864
Logitech MouseMan Wheel USB (on Everglide Giganta SE)
Focus 127keys MM Keyboard.
HP SCSI Cd-Rw 7200Si
Aopen X48 Optical Disc Drive.
3Com NIc @ Tevel/3Com Cable Modem
Modded case, the "banshee". 6 fans.
3Com Palm IIIx + GoType + AxxPAC

[Joel]

Then don't switch. As for "revolutionary" technologies (TwinView, anyone?), that is just nVidia buzz word for dual-head and didn't the G400 have that over a year ago? You have to ask yourself one question, which do you want more quaility or quanity? You are talking about a company that even to this day still supports the Millennium I and still produces IMO the best cards on the market. Let's see any other card maker make that claim.

Joel

[Jorden]

I already thought it was strange for this post to have 3 entries, yet no posts showed. And the time MHW was frozen was at the time of DO's last post...

But DataOrb, read up on deleting multiple posts in the FAQ.

Oh My Gawd, I made multiple Posts or Threads!! (or delete your own threads)


Jord

[Salmonius]

They don't have the mass? They have the mass of all the others combined with the exception of ATI. That asside, I think that nvidia has had a lot of success by executing quickly and consistently. We can already see that with ATI. They now have to build quality and they are talking of a 6 months cycle too. Same with 3dfx. Voodoo6 is not even out yet but I am sure that rampage is just around the corner (as in in time for Christmas). Matrox will do the same.

The only complaint I have is that they never say anything in advance, so how am I supposed to plan my upgrades?

I don't want to buy an MX and the next day the g450, which I would prefer, comes out... And the g450 is to last me until I get a g800, so I would not a like to get a g450 and the next they release the g800.

[Himself]

Narayan,

The G450 doesn't have T&L.

[Narayan]

Oh it doesn't? Well then I feel very sorry for the poor blokes that will attempt to sell it solely on smaller die size, 'cos that's the only thing this card is worth getting for. I mean picture the scene:

Stupid Bloke - "Hello, I'd like to buy a GeForce2 MX"
Salesguy - "Sir, may I recommend this new Matrox Millenium G450 board instead? It's a fine board..."
Stupid Bloke - "Er, what makes it so special, then?"
Salesguy - "Well...it's got DDR memory, and smaller die size than the G400. And it costs just $100 more than the MX."
Stupid Bloke - "But the first GeForce had DDR too, and it's just as fast as the MX! Does the Matrox have anything else going for it?"
Salesguy - "Ahhhmmmm...did I mention the smaller die size...?"

Mean, ignorant or plain stupid? You decide

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Currently powered by:
P3 600EB@700, Matrox G400 32MB DH, QDI Advance 9, 128MB PC133 Goldstar

[Greebe]

I pick "D. all the above"!

[DuRaNgO[MU]]

is that your FINAL answer?

[Greebe]

Yes Regis, that's my FINAL answer.

[Shandra]

Hi Folks,

Hard to keep up...?... I'm sorry, but I got my G400 from stard on (at least for Germany)... Ok, there were some probs - resolved -> thanks to the folks here... but from then on, I am pleased with it.
Ok, I am a gamer - but also I need my PC for my work as a student......
And no fragging card, for the money I am willing to pay, can beat my G400... or even my G200 on my 2nd PC for my need there (or at least I can say: what I have is what I need)...
With games -> well, just primary PC counting here - I call the G400 adequate for the games
I play.... Smooth, sharp and with good colours too..
What has a GeForce really to offer, or what game does need a better quality, so that I may be forced to upgrade now????
In time, Matrox will be offering something new, and maybe then, just maybe... I may be considering it again...



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CU,
SHAnDRA
dow gon

System: Celeron500, AsusP2B-F (1010 Bios), 192MB
16,8 GB IBM HD, 10,2 GB Maxtor HD, Samsung 604F DVD
SBLive (LiveWare2.1), G400 32MB SH (5.20 certified)
Realtek SNE2000, Diamond SupraExpress 56e (V90 Bios)
Logitech MouseMan+ (Driver 8.4), Microsoft Sidewinder Prec.Pro

[Narayan]

Cheers to you, then. Nobody said we should all upgrade, if you can do your job with a G400 then by all means you should stick to it. I know that Matrox delivers quality products, I too have a G200 in my 2nd PC (and a Mystique + m3D in my 3rd ) and I wouldn't consider ever changing it. All I said is I believe Matrox can deliver the goods sooner if they put their minds (and their cash) at it. I CAN'T WAIT ANY LONGER!

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Currently powered by:
P3 600EB@700, Matrox G400 32MB DH, QDI Advance 9, 128MB PC133 Goldstar

[Brian R.]

What is this crap about being a Matrox "fan" anyway? That's the most ridiculous thing I've ever heard. Matrox is a company which may or may not have my respect, but I am certainly not ever a fan of a company that builds video cards and makes money off of me. I may be a Chicago Bulls fan, I may be a Bears fan, but I will never be a fan of a company (or a company's stock either).

Don't defend Matrox if they have a weak point. If they appear weak, it is not because they need support from the "fans in the stands". It is because they chose not to hire enough capable programmers. Conversely, if they do well, it is because they made correct business decisions and hired the right people at the right time and persued the better path of research and marketing.

The BS of putting down NVidia and defending Matrox (or vice-versa) is silly. Buy the best video card which fills your needs and fits your budget, and forget trying to influence others whose needs and budgets are totally unknown to you.

Not long ago, an idiot (who shall remain nameless) chastised me for defending a person with an agressive anti-Matrox attitude with the statement "he's entitled to his own opinion". His argument went something like - would you say that if be broke into your house and told me and my family that we were total idiots? and some other crap like that...

Bad Analogy...

I will defend my or my family's physical safety and honor, not my decision on what video card to purchase.

Just MHO

[This message has been edited by Brian R. (edited 13 August 2000).]

[Riddek]

IMHO, both Narayan and Brian R. have valid points. I have been a satisfied Matrox G200 user for well over a year now. This card has suited my needs wonderfully until I recently decided that I need dual display capability. My first instinct was to rush out and buy the latest Matrox card, but I decided to do a little research first.

First off, I was suprised to find that Matrox hadn't released anything new since the G400 series a year ago. I was also suprised that the next confirmed release from Matrox would be a somewhat "mediocre" upgrade to the G450 series (according to several posts I've read on this site, anyway).

It seems the next significant upgrade from Matrox will be the G800 series. Unfortunately they aren't telling the consumer market a darn thing about it. They assume that all the satisfied users of quality Matrox products of the past will blindly and faithfully wait for the G800 upgrade to "someday" come, meanwhile turning a blind eye to the latest, greatest equipment the competition is churning out.

The problem with this strategy is that blind faith and supply & demand don't mix. While the aging (but quality) Matrox equipment falls behind the times, the competition is stealing their market share! By the time they FINALLY release something worth upgrading to, the market will be already be flooded with state-of-the-art equipment from it's competitors!

They have to realize that simply building a quality product in their fiercely competitive market is not enough these days. They also have to provide their clients with a consistant & signifigant upgrade path and some MARKETING STRATEGY.

I mean, throw us a frikkin' bone, Matrox! I've seen countless threads of random speculation on the G800 series cards. If you want the public to wait for your yet unconfirmed release date, give us a little something to whet our appetites. Do you think Universal Studios would spend millions producing a movie and not release any trailers for it? Give me a reason to wait for it.

I can't speak for everyone, but my upgrade "window" only appears once in a while and if Matrox doesn't have anything ready for me at that time, they're going to lose my business. If they have a competitive product at that time, I will probably buy Matrox. It's as simple as that. I'm sure Spock would agree with me.