hard ocp reporting Parhelia design team fired

[Chrono_Wanderer]

one of the major selling point of Parhleia was supposed to be features right? (when we saw the Parhelia launch the flash was pushing parhelia for quality, features and performance. *coach* Parhelia was a very big disappointment for me, not in terms of speed, but in terms of bugs and features.

Of course i loved their enginnering approch thought, like FAA, attampt into triple monitors and all the good stuff. However, the banding is just unexceptable, especially from a company like Matrox which is known to make more professional/high quality parts. I would expect such an alpha/major issue to appear from companies like S3 and Trident

[funky-d-munky]

I agree the banding is a problem, and it likely stems from a manufacturing defect. And for many, reason enough not to buy it. But how can you say it is lacking features? What card has more features? And bugs, well all new hardware has bugs, especially those that push the envelope.

[drslump]

the Parhelia is a great card, it has a lot of features and some of them are innovative and useful. My dissapointment comes from the Matrox PR publicity.
I mean, if matrox had spread some rumours and then here at MURC we started to speak about a great new matrox card, which is fast, feature full and with an absolut image quality will be no problem. It would have been a rumour being converted to a "fact" by the fan base. However what happen was that the own Matrox officialy advertized all this, that's the reason of my anger. I bought a product that was "incorrectly" advertized.
Maybe it wasn't Matrox intention but something that went thru the quality tests without noticing. Anyway Matrox being Matrox didn't handle the situation like some of us expected.
In the mean time I'm enjoying a "banding" enhanced Parhelia which I'm quite happy with but nest time I'll not go directly for a Matrox card but wait for the users feedback.

[Chrono_Wanderer]

i meant API specific features.

and of course... the good old days in TSB when we were wondering about RSN in 10 pgs long threads


edit: oh yea they really should have pushed the release date back to like GF FX. By that time they can probably have a tri-head card w/bug fixes + R95-700 PRO performance + DX 9 (from canned Pitou)

[Maniac]

All the above mentioned problems and its unbelivable price tag, are why its been a failure. Matrox might be a "smaller" company, but lets not forget that at one point it was a whole helluva lot bigger than Nvidia was

[Chrono_Wanderer]

yea ture... good old days when Millennium II rulez and Matrox a famous brand among pros/engineers.

[crow8k3a]

my only problem w/ the card is the banding, and the horrible tvout performance, everything for the most part output to tv clone has horrible fps, not talking about dvdmax. I hope they fix these things.

[Mad Dog]

Fixing the banding

I think most people do not understand what is involved in fixing the banding problem.

Even if the banding problem's solution is know, and a fix is waiting to tape out, it sounds like it will be an "all-layer" change.

This means Matrox have to buy a new mask set. Do you guys have any idea how much a new mask set at 0.15um costs????
It will be in the neighbourhood of $0.5million USD. That's just to start. Assuming no more bugs. Then you still have to waste a whole whack more money to "qualify" they new part.

You figure out if Matrox can make money back after this, even selling each card at $400.
The cost of JUST THE CHIP, wouldn't surprise me if it is over $100. Maybe more if their yields aren't so hot. Add on top of that the PCB and the rest of the compoonents that make the card, Matrox probably isn't making that much money. They'd have to sell an awful lot of cards to make that up.

Having said that, if that banding problem shows up on a medical image, they'll be in serious trouble.

[dZeus]

Though there are excuses for Matrox to think of to not fix the banding, but for the customer shelling out over 400 bucks for a card that exhibits banding problems, there aren't.

[Kurt]

Re: Fixing the banding

Originally posted by Mad Dog
I think most people do not understand what is involved in fixing the banding problem.

Even if the banding problem's solution is know, and a fix is waiting to tape out, it sounds like it will be an "all-layer" change.

This means Matrox have to buy a new mask set. Do you guys have any idea how much a new mask set at 0.15um costs????
It will be in the neighbourhood of $0.5million USD. That's just to start. Assuming no more bugs. Then you still have to waste a whole whack more money to "qualify" they new part.

You figure out if Matrox can make money back after this, even selling each card at $400.
The cost of JUST THE CHIP, wouldn't surprise me if it is over $100. Maybe more if their yields aren't so hot. Add on top of that the PCB and the rest of the compoonents that make the card, Matrox probably isn't making that much money. They'd have to sell an awful lot of cards to make that up.

Having said that, if that banding problem shows up on a medical image, they'll be in serious trouble.

OTOH, if you DON'T get the new mask, ppl don't buy your products anymore. It's future profit/viability against current one.

It's too bad to have a buggy solution but not fixing it is equivalent to "shooting self in foot".

Besides the Corp can always subisidize them a little...

[crow8k3a]

there are tons of solutions matrox could come to concerning the banding issue, before you complain about a decision they haven't made, why don't you see what their official determination is. if there is anything to say now, its that we haven't heard much yet and would like more updates on the situation, but as for the fix, compensation, or lacktherof, we just have to wait and see.

[funky-d-munky]

I am an optimist, but get real. The problem has been well knowen for some time, and the responce has been that it is "normal" for the card.
I believe that it is a manufacturing defect and there is nothing to do except one thing. Recall every card replace them with ? and suck up a monumental loss in the $millions, and have their name forever linked to crap video cards, and no doubt go out of business.
"there are tons of solutions matrox could come to concerning the banding issue" well lets hear 1 or 2 of those!
To note I am a huge fan of the card and the company in every respect except for the banding issue and how it is being delt with. I still can't fathom how it could have happened, and I hope some heads did roll. I mean how could it not have been checked.
Parhelia=Pinto?

[crow8k3a]

did you even read my post?, i said lots of solutions including compensatoin, 1 , could be if they could actually fix the card, thru bios drivers. Or they could give you a brandnew cadr dfree of banding, i doubt they would do that for free, or they could give us a discount on the next card w/out the banding issue. You just have to look for solutions, that are beyond the problem, is what i was saying besides 1 solution of fixing the card. Also the "normal" behavior was Haig's , meaning that all cards are doing it, but they did not say what their plans are for a "solution". One thing that u can complain about is that it is taking a while for their offficial solution to the problem.

[funky-d-munky]

Well I wouldn't call that tons of options ;>)
If it was software fixable don't you think the offical satement would be,"We are working on it."\
So now we are back to replace the card. With what?
Recall the cards. The end of Matrox.
Or give us a credit on the next card. Well that one would have to come after they (a) stopped selling the card, (b) admitted it is faulty, and (c) had a new card for us to use that credit note on.
funky

[thop]

I believe word on the street is that the banding problem is a hardware problem and cannot be fixed on already made parhelias. the 8x P is supposed to have it fixed.

So either replace them or give a rebate on a fixed one. However i believe nobody will like to spend another penny to fix sth. that shouldn't have been broken on a 400$ card in the first place.