Its Time! ..Who should be the next President?

[LAMFDTK]

heres your answers:
http://www.nara.gov/fedreg/elctcoll/faq.html#process

Is my vote for President and Vice President meaningful in the Electoral College system?

Yes, within your State your vote has a great deal of significance. Under the Electoral College system, we do not elect the President and Vice President through a direct nation-wide vote. The Presidential election is decided by the combined results of 51 State elections (in this context, the term "State" includes DC). Your vote helps decide which candidate receives your State's electoral votes. It is possible that an elector could ignore the results of the popular vote, but that occurs very rarely.

The founders of the nation devised the Electoral College system as part of their plan to share power between the States and the national government. Under the Federal system adopted in the Constitution, the nation-wide popular vote has no legal significance. As a result, it is possible that the electoral votes awarded on the basis of State elections could produce a different result than the nation-wide popular vote. Nevertheless, the individual citizen's vote is important to the outcome of each State election.

[HedsSpaz]

Your right Gurm, I did make it sound a good bit simpler than it is. I know a few people who have successfully pulled it off, and once I get out of college I intend to look into it seriously and try and figure out just the whole system works and see if I can manage it myself.

Anyway, back to political ranting. I registered libertarian. I did so for a reason. I am not going to vote libertarian however. Although I do agree with a lot of what the libertarian party says, I don't disagree with the republican party. Libertarians I've noticed, tend to have similar views to the GOP, they just take things to much greater extremes. This is essentially why I intend to vote for Bush(well, this and as several others have said, I too am rather scared of Gore), but the GOP at least to me seems to be a step in the right direction. I am to much of an extremist but I am also a realist. Whatsisface isn't going to get elected. Bush has a real chance of getting elected, and while it may be but a few small steps that he proposes, they are in the right direction.

Meanwhile, Gore would have me give up half of my hard earned money so that I can help support those who are less inclined to get off their lazy asses. (I know, thats a blanket statement, you know what I'm talking about) Anyway, if someone screws up in their youth I can understand the desire to not just let them rot and die on the streets, but taking huge chunks of my money in order to support them is not acceptable. If the alternative is that joe schmoe never gets to retire, well, thats his own damn fault.(do keep in mind that there are always exceptions, I don't mean to include anyone who do to circumstances completely beyond their control are in bad situations).

Ok, I'm going to stop now. Time to go home.

Ian

[Bixler]

I've just gotta weigh in on a comment made above by Joel

edited for conciseness:

If that was the case and major corporations shared in the tax burden equally...

The concept of taxing corporations (or ANYONE but the individual citizen) is pure smoke and mirrors, and any economist will have to admit it.

No onepays taxes except you and me, the individual wage and income earners...the lowest element in the food chain.

Even if popular media says 'we' don't care, I'm for anyone who will cut marginal tax rates for all taxpayers on a straight percentage basis, and then implement a pure flat tax with no brackets.

And while we're at it, the most effective change would be to eliminate witholding. If you're gonna pay taxes, WRITE THE CHECK! Then we'd find out how generous we REALLY are.

Corporations don't pay taxes. YOU DO. In the form of higher prices for the goods and services that they sell.

Bush says he'll cut taxes. Gore says he'll spend our money for us.

Bush. Brains or no.

[Joel]

I usually vote for the one that I feel will hurt me the least. I mean once they are elected they are basically going to do what they want to anyway. I'm not too worried about Gore's wife. For her to have her way they will have to rewrite the Constitution and that is not about to happen. I was more worried about Clinton's wife. Even though I don't fully support everything the Democrates do I feel that they are more in touch with the population as a whole than the Republicans.

Joel

[Pneumatic]

First of all I live in Texas so I can tell you first hand that Bush has some skills. We have low taxes (relative to the rest of the nation), and employment is the highest in the country. Even though we don't have some of the taxes that other states have, we have a huge surplus in our (Texas) economy. Don't get me wrong, we are still getting the crap taxed out of us. I just got a bonus check and there was $12k held out in taxes (think I'm not a little ticked?) I am not wealthy, but all of the talk about the rich getting all of the benifits from a tax cut rings quite hollow with me. Why should the people that are doing well in the nation pay a MUCH larger percentage in taxes? If I had my way we would go with a flat tax of say 17% or so. The top 5% of the people in the work force pay over 50% of the taxes already, so why should they have to pay more? Gore is talking about all of this stuff that he is going to change if elected. He has been in the White House for 8 years now, and we haven't heard any of these plans untill now. It just seems to me like he is telling us what he thinks we want to hear.

[This message has been edited by Kindness! (edited 02 October 2000).]

[cjolley]

Read my lips.... NO NEW TEXANS!
chuck


[This message has been edited by cjolley (edited 03 October 2000).]

[Paddy]

only in america.......

[LAMFDTK]

Paddy I have seen the House Of Commons on the tele....

[Gurm]

LAMFDTK:

I'm IGNORANT?

Mr. Buchanan has gone ON RECORD as saying that if we had just stayed out of the war then Hitler wouldn't have killed all those Jews.

Mr. Buchanan has publicly defended Nazis convicted of genocidal war crimes in WW2, saying they were "innocent", and that the Jews were "looking for a scapegoat".

Well, I don't really give a FLYING *expletive deleted* what his other views are, but any *expletive deleted* who plays revisionist history in order to favor a man and political party that killed 6 MILLION of my relatives can go rot in hell!

And another thing... if you honestly believe that ANY elector will willingly cast their vote for a candidate who they view as a threat to the impossibly corrupt political system which they wish to protect at all costs, then you need a serious dose of reality counseling. Ross Perot received not a single electoral vote, despite a healthy popular turnout. No, he was never in danger of winning the election, but with a popular percentage rate as high as he got, you'd think he'd get maybe a FEW electoral votes, right? No. Not a single one. Why? Because the electors will NEVER vote for anything that will disrupt their happy little two-party system.

Any politician that says he wants to get into politics to "change things" is either a liar or leaves office after a few years disgruntled and disillusioned.

So, am I so cynical as to not even vote? Nope. I'm simply gonna cast my ballot for what I see as the lesser of two evils - or at least the unknown quantity. I _know_ Gore is untrustworthy, criminally incompetent, and (if he listens to his wife) perhaps dangerous. Bush may have no track record, but at least he toked up a couple times. That makes him OK in my book. (YES, I'M BLOODY BEING SARCASTIC THERE.)

- Gurm

------------------
Listen up, you primitive screwheads! See this? This is my BOOMSTICK! Etc. etc.

[LAMFDTK]

"Mr. Buchanan has gone ON RECORD as saying that if we had just stayed out of the war then Hitler wouldn't have killed all those Jews."

Another twisted distortion to
Continue a smear campaign of a true American Patriot. This is the quote that brought out the smearsters...

"Had Britain and France not given the war guarantee to Poland," he writes, "there might have been no Dunkirk, no Vichy, no destruction of the Jewish populations of Norway, Denmark, Holland, Luxembourg, France or even Italy."

I have read this book (A Republic not an Empire) and do not agree with his possible scenarios of the WWII’s outcome. There are plenty of holes in his opinions. None are even remotely a Nazi Love fest.

He is also one record as stating,

"Hitler was "racist and anti-Semitic to the core" and committed "murder and genocide"

The liberal media has had its way with smearing the only candidate in the last decade that speaks his mind and stand firm on his beliefs. Political correctives are not part of his character. (Nor mine)

"Mr. Buchanan has publicly defended Nazis convicted of genocidal war crimes in WW2, saying they were "innocent", and that the Jews were "looking for a scapegoat".

This is another gross lie.
Buchanan wrote a piece regarding a retired autoworker in Cleveland who was forced to stand and defend himself on foreign soil by "nazi hunters". Their claim was that he was the real, Ivan the Terrible" from the death camps. Buchanan questioned the proof that put this man on the stand and was immediately smeared as a Nazi (like you did) This guy was found innocent and returned home to live with this ordeal for the rest of his life. So he defended an innocent man and look at what you believe as the truth?

"Well, I don't really give a FLYING *expletive deleted* what his other views are, but any *expletive deleted* who plays revisionist history in order to favor a man and political party that killed 6 MILLION of my relatives can go rot in hell!"

Revisionist? No, he merely wrote an opinion (wrong to many, including me) of a possible outcome of WW2. You have done a fine job in portraying the same smear of lies and HATE that many have been successful in the last few years with. Buchanan has no love of Hitler or of the Nazi party. This totally a distortion of hate. But is that not the best way to ruin a whole life worth service for three presidents and fighting for American right at home and abroad? Buchanan favors no special interest groups. This includes Gays, Israel, Unions, etc. There lies the only proof you need as to why this campain is in full swing. He is in no ones pocket. The very tactics that you despise has been showered upon PJB. You never heard any press of talking head smear Buchanan until he won in New Hampshire, That’s when it all started. Figure it out. It’s fine to have opinions and even emotional ones. But to have beliefs that are based on lies and distortions is ignorant.

BTW I would never support anyone that is a NAZI. I find that rather insulting...

[Joel]

OK guys. Let's take a moment to close our eyes, think happy thoughts, and repeat after me.

Ohmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm,
Ohmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm,
Ohmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm.

Political discussion are one of those things that can tend to get out of hand rather quickly and if it does I will be in a position to have to take some action and personally I don't want to have to do that. So let's keep it civil here.

With that said, here's my take on something else to think about. Even though at this time we tend to concentrate so much on the Presidential candidates, we also need to keep in mind their running mates. Because in the unlike chance that something was to happen to the President they would become President and we need to think if that is someone that we would also want running this country. Just a thought.

Joel



[This message has been edited by Joel (edited 03 October 2000).]

[LAMFDTK]

Thanks Father Joel, Gurm and I can handle it! We are professionals. This is a political thread. Gloves off is the best way!

[This message has been edited by LAMFDTK (edited 03 October 2000).]

[Greebe]

Actually that's Father Joel without the Ohmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm factor

[AlgoRhythm]

I think this guy is a good choice. (No, I don't like the two big parties...)

Howard Phillips
<a href="http://www.phillips2000.com">http://www.phillips2000.com</a>

AlgoRhythm

[DuRaNgO]

Vote for me, DuRaNgO, I'll put a Dual 1GB with a G800 Plus (128mb of course) in every home! Honest!
jim