OK this is just sick!!!! US people what are you doing?

[Liquid Snake]

That's horrible.

[paulcs]

OK this is just sick!!!! US people what are you doing?

I think part of the problem here is the choice of words often used in threads like this. It's a bit hard not to take personally, no matter what side of the ideological spectrum you find yourself, and it puts Americans on the left on the defensive. The disclaimer at the end seems perverse given the thread's subject line.

Paul
paulcs@speakeasy.net

[Joel]

<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">The mayor was caught on tape snorting cocaine with a hooker.</font>

And the real bad part about that is that the people reelected him Mayor anyway.

As for the news I stand slightly corrected. I of course don't condone what happen but lets also remember that these were not your normal run of the mill teenagers. These were teens that were trouble makers and for all we know they are being trouble makers again. Sorry just seeing that there might be two sides to the story.

And I have to agree with Dave too that the thread topic could be seen as insultive. Unfortunately the forums software does not allow editing of it.

Joel

[This message has been edited by Joel (edited 01 June 2001).]

[Rags]

I agree. It's like you are making a generalization about US people because of a single occurance. It's not the first time you and others have used such choice wording either, so the disclaimer really doesn't do much for me. You like to group all US people together because of what our gov't does, what's reported on the news, etc.

Rags

[Guru]

What part of "What are you doing?" is so hard to understand? This hapend in the US right! So the ones that should be doing something about it is the US people right?

Kindness! any parent that thinks that it's ok to scare his kids by sending him on a tour to a prison and have inmates shout at him should have his head examined(!), and should ask him self "why is my kid as ****ed up as he is, could it be becouse his parents are idiots(could not think of a word bad enough for this) that can not handle the responsibility of being a parent!

[paulcs]

I'm in the mood to split hairs.

Actually, it took place in the District of Columbia, a territory of the United States of America. It's kind of like Guam or the US Marshall Islands. It's where we keep our government. We wouldn't want the bums convening in a state for God's sake.

Paul
paulcs@speakeasy

[paulcs]

<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Guru:
What part of "What are you doing?" is so hard to understand? This hapend in the US right! So the ones that should be doing something about it is the US people right?</font>

Guru, you didn't ask, "what are you doing about this?" You ask, "what are you doing?" The implications are very different.

Paul
paulcs@speakeasy.net

[Greebe]

Guru, these are the very same people who need the goverment to raise their kids (and run their entire lives for that matter!) since they obviously can't and you question why they're doing this?!

[Greebe]

Shame you don't get Jerry Springer or Jenny Jones TV shows over there... I can't stand to watch them, but they do show how the lower class / trash lives their lives here. Sad but very true.

[This message has been edited by Greebe (edited 01 June 2001).]

[SCompRacer]

<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Guru:
What part of "What are you doing?" is so hard to understand? This hapend in the US right! So the ones that should be doing something about it is the US people right?

</font>

We are paying the price for our freedom, Guru. This Country does not say who can or cannot have children. The majority of US parents compete with an onslaught of world morals in decline, trying to teach their kids how to make the right choices. The other extreme is they let them run rampant.

What are we doing? Last ditch efforts to give problem children a dose of real world reality as to what they may be facing. Extreme situations require extreme measures, since the lesser ones sure are not working.

What happens when those running the programs expand them beyond their original scope as to constitute abuse to the participants? They are investigated and may be charged with crimes according to the law This can lead to suspensions or even being fired. Lawyers also get involved and start suing, and more laws are enacted.

What are we doing? Paying dearly for the price of our freedom.

[Paddy]

I find it very hard to believe that those shows are real...

[Guru]

<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by SCompRacer:
We are paying the price for our freedom, Guru. This Country does not say who can or cannot have children. The majority of US parents compete with an onslaught of world morals in decline, trying to teach their kids how to make the right choices. The other extreme is they let them run rampant.

What are we doing? Last ditch efforts to give problem children a dose of real world reality as to what they may be facing. Extreme situations require extreme measures, since the lesser ones sure are not working.

What happens when those running the programs expand them beyond their original scope as to constitute abuse to the participants? They are investigated and may be charged with crimes according to the law This can lead to suspensions or even being fired. Lawyers also get involved and start suing, and more laws are enacted.

What are we doing? Paying dearly for the price of our freedom.

</font>

I still do not think any sane goverment should allow programs like this(ones meant to scare people that is)!

Sorry if someone got offended by the topic! It was not meant as an personal attack on anyone!

Still think about it for a moment if your goverment allows programs like this, and your president does (witch the US people elected BTW)! Does it not also mean ~50% of the US population would allow it if they were in charge?

[SCompRacer]

<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by Guru:
I still do not think any sane government should allow programs like this(ones meant to scare people that is)!
</font>

Would sanity prevail if we ignored this last ditch, questionable success program meant to deter a rising juvenile crime rate? I mean the battle is pretty well lost by the time you get to the deter stage anyway. It's too late to bring them up right, if that was the problem. And there are plenty more behind them.

Society is declining, and I often wonder if it is a path that we are just destined to follow. It reminds me what Edward Gibbon wrote on the fall of ancient Athens.

"In the end, more than they wanted freedom, they wanted security. They wanted a comfortable life; and in their quest for it all, security, comfort, freedom, they lost it all.

When what they wanted finally was not to give to society but for society to give to them; when the freedom they wished for most was the freedom from responsibility, then they ceased to be free."

Seems to fit.

[Pneumatic]

For people that think Americans are so stupid, you guys sure spend a lot of time thinking about the US.

We have some messed up people and some messed up policies but the people and the policies on the whole are the best in the world (IMO ). You have to take the bad with the good but there is actually WAY more good about America than bad. Unfortunately people like Guru only like to focus on the bad.

[Gurm]

Guru,

Let's not get started on the "dumb things country X does" topic.

I could come up with a dozen examples of commonplace occurences in YOUR country that would shock, offend, and upset the majority of Americans.

But we've been over this before, haven't we? You (and several other Euro-dorks) fail to understand our concept of freedom. We fail to understand your willingness to be a docile sheep and let your government push you around.

So let's leave it, shall we? You won't convince me to give up my guns and tough-love programs, and I won't convince you that you should be allowed to keep more than 50% of what you earn.

- Gurm

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