please, please think (fairly long)

[GNEP]

Although to be fair to people here, often I have seen people completely disagreeing and getting heated in one thread, and in another thread be simulateneously jovial together. So in the end, the impression I get is that people genuinely do recognise that they disagree politically, and yet still can get along personally. Which is nice.

[Dogbert]

We just have to try not to step each toes too much
Some people (me included) seem to have at least one BIG sensitive toe

[thop]

GNEP: very true

[Alice]

Nevertheless, it was a good fight. You´r both right on many issues, except that each cannot forget that living in a different country means dealing with different perpectives. It´s like talking about those mexicans in US. I think that picking an example as "they want to get american girls pregnant" is narrowing reality. I was in Mexico some years ago and I realise that those people and quite naive and giving and on the other hand, the mexicans in US where often corrupted by society, because they are rejected. In California for example, they are treated like dirt. I remember seeing an episode in the street that stayed in my mind until now:
Mexicans are often paid 50 cents to help people bring their groceries to the car. I once saw that happenging. So here goes the mexican, all naively devoted to the job of carrying the cart next to a womans car, while she was ahead of him. In the cart was her kid, sitting in the upper chair of the cart. Sudenly, while the woman was busy talking on the phone, the child started to squirm around to get off, which was dangerous. The mexican gently picked the kid to put him back before he fell. That´s when the woman turns around and see the mexican touching her baby. She screamed at him not to touch her baby, with a look of disgust in her face. The mexican just finished his job.. well, and didn´t say anything. Then it´s natural to understand why too many mexicans became what we see now. Pardon my expression, they don´t like to be Fu**ed.
Sorry, I just had to talk about this because I feel that minoraties are too be understoud and I have the greatest of respects for imigrants, beside that their culture is a add on to every country... as long as they learn to fit in the society.
In Rome be a Roman. Unfortunately, that doesn´t always happen.

[Umfriend]

Two cannibals eating a clown. Says one: this tastes funny!

Umf

[GNEP]

[efty]

Well to ne honest I missed the action otherwise I would have participated. Besides that, I do agree with RedRed even though I do believe these discussions are helpfull in their own way. A few years ago I had completely different mentality about certain similar issues in Cyprus but now my view has soften a bit I think what was catalytic to my change was meeting the "enemy" and getting to know him. 5 Years ago when i first came to the US i met a few Turks and guess what? It turned out that we had much more in common than any other ethnic group in the University. And guess what else??? They are human too.. flesh and blood, and they have feelings and they have issues and problems and misconceptions about us as we do about them.

[Gurm]

Yep. Everyone is human. Problem is that the left-leaning folks (you know who you are) have to stop confusing "the people of country X" and the LEADERS of country X.

Do I think the Iraqi people want to kill Americans, help Al-Quaeda, and fire nukes at Israel? No, of course not. That's just silly. Sadly, the Iraqi people are also unwilling to rise up en-masse and oust their leadership... which DOES want to use nukes, kill Americans, and help Al-Quaeda.

The problem is that can't discuss this, because people refuse to look at anyone else's side.

I can see the point of the UN. The problem is that their point was mooted several years back. For TEN YEARS now SoDumb Insane has been thumbing his nose at the UN - knowing full well that they are so left-leaning that they will never do anything other than impose economic sanctions... which he ignores.

So what's a superpower like the USA to do? Relax and wait for SoDumb to fire a badly-constructed nuke at one of our allies? That's basically what everyone is suggesting.

I can ask these questions in a civil manner. Some people can answer them in a civil manner. Most can't. I expect that this thread will also get locked, because people will get out of control over the PERFECTLY REASONABLE things I have just said.

*shrug*

- Gurm

[GNEP]

/Trying desparately to think of a bad joke/

/fails/

[Wombat]

Two nuns walk into a bar...which doesn't make much sense, really. I mean, after the first one did it, the second one should have been smart enough to duck.

[Technoid]

Good Stealth joke!

[Goc]

Here's one...

A woman rushes home, bursting through the front door of her house yelling to her husband:

"Pack your bags honey, I just won the lottery! All $10 million of it .........WooooHoooo!"

"That's great darling!, he replies, "Do I pack for the beach or for the mountains?"..............................

"Who cares," she replies, "Just f**k off!"

[ZokesPro]

Originally posted by GNEP
/Trying desparately to think of a bad joke/

/fails/

Why did the chicken cross the road?

To get to the other side!

That's about the crapiest joke you can get!

[GNEP]

Yeah - but I did that one already - so how can I think of worse?

Oh - I could add to my previous "rule" - we only (collectively) need to post one or two bad jokes - not a whole raft of them! We need to keep them in reserve for other contentious (sp?) topics...

Have a good weekend all

/signs off

gnep

[goldstein]

Gurm: Some people can answer them in a civil manner. Most can't.

Maybe you should take your own advice Gurm. You tend to focus on personal attacks as opposed to sticking to the issues. You are very subtle, but you do tend to knock people individually instead of subject matter. Even in your above statement you start off with :

"Problem is that the left-leaning folks"

You are stereotyping and generalizing in one fell swoop. Like I said, take your own advice, discussions would be easier here if you did.


I have not been posting much on the Soapbox lately for this very reason, there are some members that simply need to get in
personal digs. Joel is trying his best, but we all have biases. Controlling them is easier said than done. And of couse some Murcers do not even try to hold back. I am not sure what the solution is, but perhaps a change in how forums are structured or rotating moderators. Nonetheless, it makes the Soapbox a less enjoyable place than it used to be. Much like a lot of places in the world today.


ps. I have noticed that if criticisms are levied on specific countries like the US or Israel or Iraq, some members view that as a personal attack on them. I submit that is a big mistake to interpret it that way because I bet most critics are ONLY attacking the governments of those countries and not the member who happens to live there. Get it? I hate the Phillipines or Belgium does not mean I hate Belgians. I know this seems obvious, but I can see many examples of members here who see no difference.

It would be quite amazing if we could all meet in person over beers and hash these ideas out