UK, Britain, England, Scotland

[Nowhere]

well...Queen also "rules" over Australia, Canada...whole Commonwealth

[Paddy]

Aye, just about as much as she rules over here

[Pace]

The Queen and Prime Minister Tony Blair rule over the Great Britain, possibly United Kingdom...

Northern Ireland I am not too clear on, they have an Assembly, but not too sure on its overall role.

Scotland have their own Parliament, and the Welsh also have an assembly - but Scotland and Welsh are also represented at the main Parliament (Westminster) in London. England should probably have their own Parliament too, but now Westminster is becoming seen as the English Government to an extent. Scottish and Welsh are similar to "States" in America, although possibly have less power - we cannot change that much, but it does give issues pertinent to Scotland and Wales more time.

Addendum:

From http://www.ni-assembly.gov.uk :
The Assembly is the prime source of authority for all devolved responsibilities and has full legislative and executive authority.

So, looks like the NI Assembly is the same as the Scottish and Welsh versions.

Edit: PS - beat to it

The Queen has no real power though, the Prime Minister does run the UK.

More about the Scottish Parliament: Scotland has a First Minister (Jack McConnell), who is Labour, but we are actually a Labour and Liberal Democrats coalition, and at the last check, no Conservatives have seats in Scotland - any Tory fans can thank Margaret Thatcher for that. I was hearing a story from a guy who suffered at the hands of Maggie's reign with regards to employment, that when she handed in her resignation he headed to the pub later on in the day...the pubs were packed in Glasgow (Scotland's largest city for those who have no geography ). He phoned his mate in London, and Westminster/The City was in mourning (The City means the "business" part of London).

As you would expect, the Scottish politicians (Members of the Scottish Parliament / MSPs) are not really linked to the general Members of Parliament (MPs) - and it is quite possible that we could have a Scottish Parliament governed by the SNP (Scottish National Party), and Westminster governed by Labour or Conservatives.

[KvHagedorn]

From what I have read about "Scots" or "Lallans," it is an English dialect, one of a great many in the British Isles. I haven't heard it spoken (that I know of) nor have I studied it, so I have no real opinion as to its status myself.

Actually I thought they mainly spoke English on the Channel Islands, too.

[Pace]

Some Scots: http://www.scottishgreens.org.uk/policies/prinscot.htm

I would consider it a very extreme dialect - while almost every word is a variation on the English word, it is quite different. If you search for some Robert/Rabbie Burns poetry, you will see stuff even further from English than the above.

[KvHagedorn]

From seeing that I would say it's definitely a dialect, not a separate language. The syntax and grammar is the same as Modern English, and it's easier to follow than Middle English in some ways, if you knew the colloquialisms. As I said elsewhere, there are many dialects in Germany too, and there are differing opinions on whether Dutch is indeed a separate language from German. Actually, I think it is, and so is Plattdeutsch, but Swabian is just a dialect. Any opinions from Germans/Dutch here?

Here's a Plattdeutsch link: http://www.plattmaster.de/links.htm#spraak

[Brian Ellis]

Lallans is definitely considered as a separate language. The bastardisation with English started only recently (in the past 200-300 years) and this has brought it closer to what seems a dialect, but its roots are much older even than modern English. It is not known where/when/how it started, but was probably brought in by invaders from Jutland in the 7th-10th centuries, possibly similar to the Anglo-Saxons, who came in from further south. The etymology of many of the words is very distinct from English. Even today, the pronunciation of words which are traditional and are similar to English (and that is about 50% of them) is totally different and that is why English speakers cannot understand the language. If we compare this to English as spoken in Scotland, with an admixture of a few Lallans and Gaelic words and variable dialectal syntax/vocabularly, it is a totally different kettle of fish. Even more telling is a comparison with Northumbrian and Geordie, which ARE English dialects spoken just to the south of the Lallans region. Geordie is possibly the most extreme dialect and is difficult to understand by most English-speaking persons, but not impossible with concentration. A Lallans-speaker is impossible, but there are very few who cannot speak English, as well, probably because it is not an official language in the sense that official decrees are not translated into it. Look at it this way, Lallans developed separately but in parallel with English, the Jutts, the Angles and the Saxons being the originators, no doubt their original languages being dialectal variations of the same Germanic tongues 1,200 years ago. As Scotland was independent from England until 1603, despite various attempts at union by force, the main influence of the dominant English language relegated the then widely-spoken Lallans to the more remote hill regions to the south of the main populated region after that date. The other Scottish language, Gaelic (totally different, being Celtic, not Germanic) was similarly relegated to the northern Highlands at the same time. The original border line between the two cultures was roughly Arbroath, Dundee, Perth, down to the Firth of Clyde, possibly near Helensburgh.

[az]

KvH, Dutch is definately a different language, I'd say (though of course closely related), and Plattdeutsch, now that you mention it, seems like a different language, too. I think it once broke off frome the path that Hochdeutsch continued to follow (dunno when, though), and it definately contains many english/roman influences. Swabian (schwäbisch), Bavarian (Bayerisch) etc. are just dialects, I'd say (though someone speaking only Hochdeutsch may sometimes not be able to understand a single word ).

This is all my personal, completely unfounded opinion

AZ (whose only dialect is Berlinerisch, though only used on purpose)

[RedRed]

http://www.ianjamesparsley.net/ullans.html

Lallans (or ullans here) link site


Translations of most papers produced by our assembly are available in Ulster Scots

Full of the biggest bunch of twisted, bigotted sister-marying idggitts (Idiots - scots Irish for you!) there are

RedRed

[Brian Ellis]

az

Then we have Schwyzertüüütsch which is not one dialect but probably about 10 or 15. What is interesting is that a Hochwalliser meeting a Zürcher has to use "Schrifttütsch" or Hochdeutsch, even for the simplest conversation! Neither can understand the other in their respective local dialects.

[UtwigMU]

Well, we have huge dialect (7 major, 45 minor dialects based on 7 major ones) mess here.

There was also an isolated German language island here (they got relocated by Hitler, since that part was granted to Italy during WW2), which developed some strange version of language.

[KvHagedorn]

Well, Slovenia was a pretty integral part of Austria for centuries, so I would imagine there would be some German-speaking minorities from that time.

[UtwigMU]

Actually it was the opposite:

Austria is lower Austria and higher Austria.

Styria and Carinthia (Stajerska, Koroska) are traditional Slovenian regions.

The place where ritual of installing Slovenian leader took place is in today's Austria.



Europe 600 A.D. - Sclaveni - Sloveni - Slovenci - Slovenians



Map of Europe at 800 A.D. (year of Charlemagne's/Charles the Great's coronation)



Here's a map of Great Carantania, part of the Empire at that time.

Untill 8th (745 lost independance, 823 lost internal independance) century there was an independant Slovenian state that compriesed much of today's Austria.

For instance Jefferson was inspired by Slovenian ritual of installation of Ruler.

from Clinton's visit page
We venture to say, that the story of American democracy begins in Carinthia, the first Slovene state in the 7th century.
Reading the French historian Jean Bodin's account of the Slovene ritual installation and the democratic arrangement between people and ruler is said to have inspired Thomas Jefferson in writing the draft of his Declaration of Independence.

JEFFERSON, THOMAS (1743 - 1826)
The ancient ritual of installing Carinthian dukes carried out in the Slovene language whereby the Slovene peasantry transferred the sovereign power to make laws for their community to the dukes fascinated the celebrated humanist Aeneas Silvius Piccolomini, better known as Pope Pious II. The French legal historian and philosopher Jean Bodin, inspired by Piccolomini's tireless praise, examined the ritual in detail and described it as an original idea for the transfer of sovereignty that "had no parallel throughout the world".

So there is a persuasive documentation that this contractual relationship influenced the famous Virginian and that the story of American democracy begins in Carinthia (Karantania), the first Slovene state in the 7th century. The ritual installation of the duke of Carinthia that derived from those times was conducted in the Slovene language until the fifteenth century. The installation helped Jefferson develop the theory of the right of people to appoint their own leaders and of the power that emerges from the people themselves, ideas that he drew on when writing the Declaration of Independence.

Anyway. After that Carantania was divided among various feuds, however it was still politically important in empire.

In 15th century there was last Slovenian (In Slovenian language) ritual of installing ruller.

During medieval colonization manny feudal rullers brought German speaking colonists, so national border start moving south.

Austria as such is successor of Habsburg monarchy. Habsburgs who started coming into power in 13th century. With good dynasty building marriages and politics they becamme strong (even elected emperors of The Holy Roman Empire).

The name itself (Oestereich, Eastern Kingdom is derived from the term Eastern Border March - border march is politically important feud - Markengraff/marquis).

In 19th century (start of nationalist movements in Europe, before state was more associated with feudal ruller than language/culture) pressure started.



Map of Slovenian lands published in 1853 - era of National movements, compare to Great Carantania and today's borders, erosion of national teritory is apparent.

When Austria-Hungary fell appart after WW1 Slovenian army was formed (it also had air force!!!) that has saved our north east national borders.

In north plebiscite took place in 1920, 41% voted for SHS, 59% for Austria.

Reasons for loosing northern regions:
- Slovenian national movement was less strong than in Carniola, due to strong German population
- After WW1 Slovenia, Croatia, Bosnia and Vojvodina (today's northern Serbia) were forced to join with Serbia and Monte-Negro (independant from Turks! since 1878) in order to gain recognition and preserve national borders. This deterred people in Carinthia to vote for that country since people had little in common with Orthodox Serbs, who were on opposite side during WW1. It also latter led to tragic wars that took place in Yougoslavia latter in the 20th century.
- Mistakes by Slovenian leadership, all or nothing politics, international pressure (Wilson's nation building after WW1).

The southern German speaking language island (that mainly wasn't nazi and didn't seek quarell with neighbouring Slovenes) was relocated to eastern Slovenia by Hitler, since he granted those lands to Italy.

For instance my father's uncle qualified as German during WW2. He went to Austria after the war and subsequently moved to France, where he still lives (over 80 now).

They moved from Slovenia after WW2 (big migrations). Leadership confiscated all property of Germans that took part in WW2 as war reparations (similar things happened in Czechoslovakia - now two countries).

Today German speaking minority is almost nonexistant. About 500 people qualified themselves as German nationals during last population census.

Similar has happened to Slovenian miniority in Austria. Where 41% voted for State of SHS (Slovenes, Croats Serbs) in 1920 the number has decreased by now substantially (roughly 10-20%).

Our minority in Austria still strives for language rights guaranteed by constitution. For instance there was a hunger strike on Slovenian minority radio recently as state cut the funding.



Map of electoral regions, today's Slovenia.

[Nowhere]

here we have 4 mayor dialects and several smaller (which are parts of the big 4). But overall there are no problems with understanding each other...apart the Kashub language at the north (which was considered by many as 5th mayor dialect - it isn't), which is the last one survived from the Pomeranian group of languages (which is part of west Slavonic languages, Polish is also). Anyway, all Kashubs speak Polish, so that's not a problem.

But the differences are really small - most of the people here speak something that can be called literary dialect of Polish language - probably because of lost of independency during whole 19th century and massive relocations in 20th.

An of course there are etnical minorities...

btw, is/was there a German dialect...somewhere in the environs of Leipzig maybe...which have "gothic" in definition (very) maybe?

[Brian Ellis]

Any views on Rhaeto-Romansch (which is an official language in Switzerland, spoken as a native language in parts of Graubunden/Grisons)? The schools in some areas use it as the main language. There are newspapers and a radio station, while the Swiss-German TV shows some programmes in it. Until recently, there were about 15 dialects in 5 idioms of this language, each from a different valley. However, in order to preserve its rich cultutal heritage, a 'single' Rhaeto-Romansch has been developed, taking the best out of each dialect. There are currently about 56,000 native speakers. It is possibly the oldest native language spoken in Europe, although some Celts and the Basque people deny this.

An example of the 5 main idioms and the "melting-pot" version can be seen at http://www.liarumantscha.ch/rr/ruidioms.html