The Matrix Reloaded

[Ajax]

Just a thought...
Suppose the machines did roll back the clock say 100 years, and try to program that into those still connected to the matrix. There would be many who would not accept the code, and would probably be exterminated... but look at how much the world population has grown in the past century. Setting the matrix back, and letting the majority of the people reject it, would still fit in with history.

[leech]

Which tells us nothing about the passage of time.

That was pretty much my whole point. There's really nothing to say in the Matrix movies about the passage of time, except that Zion has been fighting for 100 years and that this is the 6th iteration. Saying that the Merovingian is 800ish, is just a guess, even saying that he's from the original lines of the Merovingian kings (yes, I'm aware of them, though most of my studies have been pre-christian era.) If you want to get into that, the Merovingians were also believed to be "Fish-people" Which also is what EA/ENKI of the Sumerian was depicted as. He was the creator of mankind in the Sumerian history.

But of course that's not what this rude 'ancient one' is supposed to represent. I mean if that were really the case, then why isn't the One a Merovingian, since there is the theory that they were descendants of Christ?

As Wulfman said, just because he uses the name, doesn't mean that he is 1500 years old. Once again, if the time is accelerated within the Matrix, and he is a Program, just like the Oracle and the Keymaker and Seraph, etc. Then time is irrelevant to him. I don't think the Matrix suffers from the Y2K bug

Leech

[Gurm]

It's pretty clear that he's an ancient frenchman.

He has vampires at his beck and call.

He has a castle in France.

He is described as "ancient and dangerous", and "from an ealier version of the Matrix".

- Gurm

[leech]

I don't ever recall it saying that his Castle was in France. I thought it odd that he had Italian 'werewolves', A Chinese guy, and a few other weirdos that fought Neo. (The only vampires I know of were in the Enter the Matrix game.) Vampires actually are not from the French, so that point is moot.

Ancient and Dangerous indeed. He's obviously been around, I'm just saying that there is no definite time frame. Being ancient in the Matrix could easily be 100 years or even 10000. But what happens when a program gets ancient? It's obsoleted and usually people prefer using the upgraded version. So maybe he's like a virus that just kind of stays around on your harddrive, even after you've upgraded your OS.

Leech

[Topha]

Originally posted by leech
Ancient and Dangerous indeed. He's obviously been around, I'm just saying that there is no definite time frame. Being ancient in the Matrix could easily be 100 years or even 10000. But what happens when a program gets ancient? It's obsoleted and usually people prefer using the upgraded version. So maybe he's like a virus that just kind of stays around on your harddrive, even after you've upgraded your OS.

Leech

Like win95

[Wulfman]

Originally posted by Gurm
It's pretty clear that he's an ancient frenchman.

He has vampires at his beck and call.

He has a castle in France.

He is described as "ancient and dangerous", and "from an ealier version of the Matrix".

- Gurm

imho no
yes - ..and? couldn't that make him rumanian?
what, have I missed something? (..out in the mountains, heard nothing about france).
those points fit on a lot of people (cthulhu is quite ancient & evil for example )

yes, his style makes him look like he is from France - sure. but maybe the wachowskies just thought "we need an evil, narcissist character who speaks french 'cos he can swear in this language without parental control kicking up our age rating for matrix. let's call him merowinger, makes him even more believable."

mfg
wulfman

[VJ]

Originally posted by Gurm
PLUS... in the first movie it talks about how people are born, live their lives, grow old, and die... all in the simulation. That their entire lives are part of the simulation, not just implanted memories.

Hmm, who says that people die in reality when they die in the Matrix ? Perhaps when they die in the matrix, their minds in reality are simply erased and they are reborn... (reincarnation ?)...

This however still doesn't allow the entire matrix to "re-iterate"... But couldn't they just use some form of breakpoint (with backup/restore of the people's minds) ?
(e.g. the Matix has a problem in 1999, so we simply roll back to a certain year, make some minor adjustments (a new "one") and let it "run" again)
It would explain the concept of "deja-vu" and "visionairs" in the Matrix-world: i.e. badly erased memories...

My guess would be that end the end of the third movie, a "roll-back" as described above is done, causing the viewer to remain in doubt wether his/her life is real or a simulation in the Matrix.



Jörg

[VJ]

Oh, the rollback-concept would allow the time in the matrix to return to a certaint time, whereas the real-time just goes on. The "problem" mentioned can then be seen as a bug (ooh, the Smith quote !) the machines are trying to identify. And the bugs shows up every 100 years. Every re-iteration of the matrix is simply a next attempt at the program.

(If you program something, and it gives problems at a certain point, you will also try to get to that certain point as fast as possible, after making some modifications.)


Jörg

[Wombat]

The problem with your "reincarnation" is that for one, people who reject the matrix, and wake up, apparently have a body exactly matching their avatar. Proof? No, but extremely high coincidence if you're right.

[leech]

If I recall correctly, in the first one Morpheus says that the dead are fed intravenously to the living.

I agree with VJ, they'll put a twist on the end to make everyone wonder if their life is real/fake/simulated. Wether or not some of their memories are just programs running.

Cool movie either way

Leech

[Byock]

I think when the 3rd comes out, we need to bump this thread, and see who is right, and who is the weakest link.

[Jon P. Inghram]

Since it's Matrix: Revolutions not Revolution, thus: Revolutions indicating revolving in a circle, returning to the starting point, blah blah.

[leech]

Would that mean that we'd have to bump the Original Matrix thread? (I'm sure there was one on here )

Leech

[Wombat]

Okay, new theory. Zion isn't another level of the Matrix - there's a part of Neo still there, just as Smith is in the Matrix and in Bane somehow. Realizing, and using that link let Neo do something to the squids, but cost him his consciousness in the real world.


It needs work, but it's a seed idea.


(Enter the Matrix has the Oracle saying that Neo's mind and body are separated, this is the best I can figure from that).

[leech]

You may be on to something there, Wombat. One thing's for sure, to get the full story you almost have to play Enter the Matrix. Anyone figure out how to merge the adx (audio files) with the avi's (Divx files) for the game so for those like Byock where the game will make him physically ill, can watch the movies anyhow?

Leech