"Blu-ray Disc" vs. "HD DVD": Neither Is Winning

[Brian Ellis]

Thanks for making my point.

I didn't, far from it.

Your point is that downloading inflexible Apple films is the future.

My primary point is that, for the moment, upscaled 576i DVDs are PDG and do not require expensive and controversial technology, nor even a connection to the outside world, and are affordable, even in developing countries and by us impoverished pensioners. My secondary point is that, when the dust settles and either HD-DVD or BR has won their war, so that the winner becomes standardised and prices affordable, then there is every chance they will displace SD DVDs. My tertiary point is that downloading HD video, at the same quality as HD DVDs of either flavour, is not a practical proposition and highly compressed MD video will not satisfy the public. My quaternary point is that the public will, like today, continue to buy something concrete they can hold in their hand.

[Brian Ellis]

But both of those technologies are dead as disco.

Looks like you are in an army of one! At least you can keep in step!

[Jerry Jones]

New article about how both high definition DVD formats are failing.

http://www.tech.co.uk/home-entertainment/high-definition/news/why-hd-dvd-vs-blu-ray-is-still-a-cold-war?articleid=259094400

It's amazing how both the Blu-ray and the HD DVD camps are parading their woefully small sales figures as though they are actually significant. The DVD version of Transformers sold 44 times as many as the HD DVD version, which demonstrates what a battle the HD formats have in order to win over the general consumer. HD's biggest competitor? It's DVD.

Told you so.

Brian, you think DVD will give way to high definition DVD.

I think DVD is the end of optical disc video technology that is adopted by the masses.

I stand by my assertion.

DVD will give way to hard disks and wireless media streaming.

APPLE isn't the only company involved in offering hard disk and wireless media streaming technology.

1. SanDisk TakeTV:

http://www.take.tv/

2. ARCHOS TV+:

http://www.archos.com/products/gen_5/archos_tv/index.html?country=global&lang=en

3. TViX HD M-5100SH:

http://www.tvix.co.kr/Eng/products/5100sh.aspx

4. TViX HD M-4000PA/M-4000SA

http://www.tvix.co.kr/Eng/products/HDM4000.aspx

5. TViX HD M-4100SH:

http://www.tvix.co.kr/Eng/products/4100sh.aspx

6. D-Link DSM-520:

http://www.dlink.com/products/?sec=1&pid=438

7. D-Link DSM-510:

http://www.dlink.com/products/?sec=1&pid=542

8. D-Link DSM-750:

http://www.dlink.com/products/?sec=1&pid=547

The field just keeps growing!

Jerry Jones

http://www.jonesgroup.net

[Tjalfe]

Just curious, when DVD was the same age as HDDVD/BD what did the sales figures look like compared to VHS?

[Hulk]

1. Most consumer high definition camcorders can't truly resolve 1920 x 1080.
2. If you don't like 960 x 540 for home media streaming, you don't have to buy the APPLE TV, you can buy the TViX devices, which support full 1920 x 1080.
3. I'm not pushing anything; I'm just saying the war is over and streaming devices/hard disks have won.

If you want to buy a Laserdisc or Blu-ray device, then buy it.

But both of those technologies are dead as disco.

Bye.

Jerry Jones
http://www.jonesgroup.net

Yes but consumer cams can resolve 1440x1080 which is a long way from the Apple TV 960x540.
Don't worry I won't be buying the Apple TV. I'm going to build an HTPC box that will be nearly as inexpensive but will decode ANY video on the drive. And of course it will do other things as well.
Your stating "the war is over" is premature. I think most people "in the know" would agree with that sentiment.



There are some disco tracks that I like quite a bit.

"Boogie Oogie Oogie"
"That's the Way I Like It"
"Car Wash"

Just to name a few.

I'm glad we have come to a "resolution" on this issue.

[Jerry Jones]

More evidence that hard disks and wireless streaming are the future:

http://www.informationweek.com/news/showArticle.jhtml?articleID=202600286

IBM (NYSE: IBM) disclosed Monday that it has teamed up with Taiwanese vendor MediaTek to develop computer chipsets that the companies say will allow consumers to wirelessly zap high-definition content to televisions and other devices at push-button speeds.

Dubbed mmWave, the chipsets -- which comprise computer chips and high-speed interconnects -- will use so-called millimeter wave radio technology to transmit the data.

The technology employs ultra-high radio frequencies capable of sending and receiving large amounts of data at extremely high speeds to create what IBM and MediaTek are calling "revolutionary multimedia wireless products."

Devices utilizing the technology would be capable of receiving a 10-Gbit file in about 5 seconds, compared to 10 minutes using current Wi-Fi systems. "This collaborative effort will enable consumers to wirelessly transfer large multimedia data files around their home and/or offices in seconds," said T.C. Chen, VP for science and technology at IBM Research, in a statement.

Told you.



Jerry Jones

http://www.jonesgroup.net

[Tjalfe]

so when that becomes available globally, hddvd/bd will have lived a nice long life. In the mean time, I believe dual format players will phase out regular DVD players and DVD sales will slowly be replaced with the high resolution formats as people buy new players to replace their dying DVD players.

[Jerry Jones]

http://www.thebitbag.com/index.php/2007/10/22/why-hd-dvd-blu-ray-will-not-succeed/

"Why HD DVD and Blu-ray Will Not Succeed"

Jerry Jones

http://www.jonesgroup.net

[Tjalfe]

are you doing much more than posting google hits to "Why HD DVD and Blu-ray Will Not Succeed" ?

[Jerry Jones]

http://www.blackfriarsinc.com/blog/2007/10/apple-tv-just-preview-of-coming-upgrade

Encrypted peer-to-peer (P2P) Internet distribution. Despite Apple's long-standing relationship with Akamai and its new high-definition video distribution system, we believe that Apple has built an encrypted BitTorrent-like distribution system into Leopard, Apple's new operating system scheduled to be released this month. While any consumer will be able to download high-definition movies, Apple users with Leopard or an Apple TV device will be able to opt-in and redistribute those movies to other users in exchange for iTunes credits. In essence, Apple's customers will become a secondary distribution channel for iTunes and will save Apple millions in bandwidth charges to boot. But to guarantee the security and safety of this system, consumers will need Leopard as their platform.

Fascinating rumor.



Jerry Jones

http://www.jonesgroup.net

[wkulecz]

My tertiary point is that downloading HD video, at the same quality as HD DVDs of either flavour, is not a practical proposition and highly compressed MD video will not satisfy the public.

I'm not so sure, a generation raised on MP3 and youtube probably wouldn't know A/V quality if it bit them.

I've wondered for a long time how Hollywood films survived, as I quit going to the movies many years ago when the theaters stopped seeming to care how poor quality their projection stocks were.


When we first got the HDTV and I enabled 480p on the DVD player I was amazed (and disgusted) that I could now see the scratches in the film the DVD was made from!

--wally.

[Jerry Jones]

http://crave.cnet.com/8301-1_105-9674879-1.html

CRAVE gets its hands on the brand new SlingCatcher media streamer!

...and more from Engadget.Com:

http://www.engadget.com/2007/10/23/slingcatcher-box-reveals-codec-support-why-hello-xvid/

Jerry Jones

http://www.jonesgroup.net

[Jerry Jones]

When we first got the HDTV and I enabled 480p on the DVD player I was amazed (and disgusted) that I could now see the scratches in the film the DVD was made from!

This is so true.

The only films that seem to truly benefit from HD are new animated films and very new films.

As far as many older classic films and TV shows are concerned, there's not much benefit in going to HD, in my view.

The only other benefit of HD is new documentaries shot with very good HD cameras.

Jerry Jones

http://www.jonesgroup.net

[paulw]

Anyone got a copy of the new Star Trek TOS in HD DVD?? I believe it was restore from the 35mm masters and new CG work done to bring it up to date.. If it's as good as the sales pitch then there could be a good reason to go HiDef.

Oh and another thingy to watch your download content on.

http://www.vudu.com/

[Hulk]

so when that becomes available globally, hddvd/bd will have lived a nice long life. In the mean time, I believe dual format players will phase out regular DVD players and DVD sales will slowly be replaced with the high resolution formats as people buy new players to replace their dying DVD players.

Exactly. And thank you for adding some sanity to this insane thread.


Jerry,

And do you really think that all those 35mm movies only have 720x480 resolution in them and scanning the frames any higher won't produce any more detail?

I have read that 35mm film is at LEAST 6 megapixel equivalent resolution. My own experience with film seems to confirm that.

1080p is "only" about 2 megapixels. I think many, many restored films will be able to provide good clean scans at 1080p resolution.

Imagine what 480p would look like blown up to movie theater screen size. It would look like crap. 35mm film probablyl from the '60's on up to date (or earlier) will look great when transferred to HD by people who know how.

If Doc is reading this thead I believe he has the experience to let us know if old films can be scanned higher than with 480 lines of resolution for additional viewing benefit.