car buying these days...

[UtwigMU]

Still driving a 1997 Lancia Kappa 2.4 20v.
TCO is very high, especially with my driving profile.

Love the car, jealous of the European ones where the climate is much more forgiving.
I'm actually buying replacement parts from Poland.

I rode with TransformX in his Lancia 2.4. It has great acceleration and I can confirm his driving style is not eco.

[TransformX]

Still driving a 1997 Lancia Kappa 2.4 20v.
TCO is very high, especially with my driving profile.

Love the car, jealous of the European ones where the climate is much more forgiving.
I'm actually buying replacement parts from Poland.

[VJ]

We managed to drive to Belgium on the 25th, and are just back in Poland.
The car is very comfortable, we managed to do the 1400km in one day without feeling exhausted (both going and coming back). The active cruise-control (one of the functions of the Subaru Eyesight system) is great. It anticipates and reacts as a driver would. If you approach a slower vehicle, it notifies that it sees it and then a bit later decreases the gas to slow down. If you move to the next lane to overtake, it starts accelerating during the move. If the car in front leaves the lane, it waits to accelerate until the lane is clear. And if a car cuts in front of you and has speed, it does not brake but just slightly decreases the gas if the car does not move away fast enough. All very natural - I read it is one of the best systems on the market, and having used it extensively on this trip, it never behaved in an unpredictable way and never caught me by surprise. At one point traffic suddenly packed up (car cut in front of us and suddenly everyone in front started braking) and the car nicely braked right before my wife wanted to. The lane detector nicely shows when it cannot recognize the lanes. It sometimes failed to see the yellow lines (during road works), but once you cross the white line (ignoring the warning) it won't notify again until you are back in a lane (and shows you it is not checking lanes for now). As a driver, you are very well informed about which systems are active and which not.

The noise levels in the car are very low, so that also is comfortable. While it is a CVT, it appears to jump to some points if it is beneficial (I guess to faster reach a more optimal rpm for power under acceleration). I haven't noticed the droning noise often associated with CVTs. It is weird to see how the RPM varies smooth without the speed changing (e.g. uphill or downhill, or small speed adjustments). We are at 3000 km now and will have the first oil change (not mandatory, but recommended). It switches to electric mode when driving slow, and the switch is barely noticeable. You cannot accelerate much in EV mode or it will restart the engine, but for constant driving it does maintain it for some time. In EV mode it makes a noise for pedestrians (EU regulation), which you can just about hear as some metallic whirr. The suspension smooths out cobblestones, seams in bridge surfaces and things like that.

The ventilation works very well and scales from lowest setting where you don't feel anything to a highest setting that really works fast. Defrosting the wipers, wind-shield and mirrors works very efficiently.

I would not call it very sporty, but it is something I do not care about; it has enough power reserve to be safe e.g. when overtaking. We did not fully check the fuel consumption, the first leg was quite bad (-11C, cold start, cold and new car, winter tires) but it improved and now I think we are well below 7l/100 km for highway driving (120 kph) with some headwind (wind turbines along the road were an indicator for this).

The built-in gps is quite simple but effective. The spoken commands are minimal yet clear, the information (lanes, junction view, exit names) seems accurate, as does the time estimate. My previous Kenwood DNX-8220 did have a few more tricks up its sleeve (show turn list, show traffic information, possibility for paid RDS-TMC traffic information sources), but was missing some other features the new navigation has. We haven't yet tried Android Auto. USB playback is fine, although I think the sound quality of my Kenwood was slightly better (but not really a noticeable difference while driving). We still have to check some playlist options (it plays the files alphabetically). Voice control works well, as long as you are using English words. A bit of an issue with Polish street names in the navigation or Belgian and Polish peoples' names for dialling - as with all such systems.

All in all very happy with the car so far.

As a hint: driving on Christmas day in Europe is a dream: empty roads everywhere. The return on 8th of January also was very calm (6/1 is a holiday in Poland, so a Saturday in the middle of this long weekend is also calm).

[VJ]

TCO for a car in Poland is quite low, as there is no annual tax (it is included in the fuel price). So apart from insurance and annual technical check, the only costs are the costs to the car (service, fixing). As a result, we are not selling any car immediately. My father-in-law would be more tempted to keep the Hyundai because it is newer, but he never drove Polo.. and he never had a car for longer than 7 years (he tends to buy quite low end cheap cars and does not expect them to last long), so a 19 year old car to him must be tragic. My mother in-law is the main user of the Hyundai and she prefers to drive Polo.

And... we ordered the Subaru... It is at the dealer's, and with a bit of luck we should be able to manage the administration before the end of next week. Christmas time visit to Belgium by car seems very possible again.

[UtwigMU]

I nearly cried when I sold my Polo but I was looking at 3x car's value engine rebuild. If I had a garage I'd keep it but it made no financial sense to do so.

Your Polo is on the side of curve where value of car will start to go up and you can get oldtimer (don't know how it's in Poland, here it's 25 years) status and then very cheap TCO. If you won't drive it too much, it should be still OK for local drives. Also if you did all the big maintenance, which I think comes at around that mileage, you're good to go for several more km, at least 250k. Parts are not that expensive, many people in Poland know how to fix it and repairs are not that expensive there.

So TCO should be at around 250-300 EUR a month. Definitely keep the Polo.

[VJ]

On the car thing... Which car would you get rid off?

1. VW Polo 2003 Comfortline (airco, comfort seats, ...) with automatic gear box, 178000 km, fully serviced at VW, mobility warranty still working
2. Hyunday i10 from 2011, in its most basic version, approx. 60000km (estimated)

Neither car has mechanical or electrical problems. There is a bit of oil usage on the Polo, but it was checked and according to the dealer, thicker oil should solve it. We are thinking of selling the Hyundai... The main reasons for us to change cars are not related to the reliability of the Polo but rather comfort on long highway drives and prospects or the car-market. It is more comfortable, bigger and more highway capable than the i10.... It adds navigation, radio and handsfree but it is 8 years older... The i10 is used by my mother-in-law, and she does not drive much but prefers driving Polo...

[UtwigMU]

We're in talks to build a new block to our existing nuclear plant.

[VJ]

In Belgium they will close the nuclear powerplants in 2025 (fixed date). They plan to build 6 gas powerplants to compensate, but they don't even have locations/permissons for any of them. No way they can be planned/approved/built in 3-4 years. Combined with the changes regarding mandatory heat pumps in new houses and removal of tax incentives on fuel cars, and the fact that electricity import is maxed out, and it is a disaster in the making.

So... I guess we will get 15 years of extremely high electricity prices to finance it all?

If we are lucky, it will just mean high prices. We may also be looking at frequent blackouts...

It is one of the reasons we are not considering electric: for sure fuel will get more expensive, but then you are not likely to loose mobility (if you are willing to pay, you can drive ). With electric, it will also get more expensive and/or you may not be able to charge when you want to (e.g. no capacity for fast charging or so, so even if you are willing to pay, you may not be able to drive).
Maybe I'm too pessimistic with that.... I hope so...

[dZeus]

A much bigger problem than electricity prices will be the powerline infrastructure, that is already at or near capacity. All this future growth requires investments, planning and work taking at least 10-15 years to be materialized. Until then it will severely limit the speed of electrification (ie heatpumps and EVs).
So... I guess we will get 15 years of extremely high electricity prices to finance it all?

[VJ]

And Belgium in 2025...
... while forbidding gas in new buildings (mandatory heat pumps) and removing tax incentives on fuel-powered company cars...

[UtwigMU]

Wait for electricity prices until Germans shutdown all their nuclear plants.

[VJ]

Second test drive with the CX-30 and second test drive with the XV... (at highway speeds)

The visibility around the car in the CX-30 is not so good:, both the high, long nose and the small rear window are limiting. The rear view mirrors are positioned quite far back (to avoid a bigger blindspot behind the A-pillar), but neither my wife nor me are driving in a reclined position (we prefer the seat rather straight), which positions those mirrors almost next to you (a bit exaggerated, but too far back for comfort). Quite tiresome to look in the mirrors e.g. on the highway (and the blind spot monitor is a small indicator at the far end of the mirror - it is also a very delicate indication on the head-up display). Maybe something to get used to... may be one of those small annoyances that you keep carrying on forever. Not sure. The space in the back is also limited (while sitting, my shin was touching the - soft - bottom edge of the seat in front, and it was not even that far back).

The XV has much more space in the back, I could even see the tip of my shoes. The mirrors are positioned less back than on the CX-30 and the car seems to better fit with a straight driving position. Visibility around is amazing: the car is quite a bit bigger than our Polo, but you immediately feel comfortable with the dimensions and have no problem estimating where the car is and parking it, even on a first try. This confidence in manoeuvring is nice... The image on the reverse camera includes the bumper, so you can really estimate it well, and the sensors are only triggering when it gets really close (not full red when there is 50cm, like on my parents' Opel). The CX-30 was not as bad as the Opel, but more conservative than the XV. The XV is more expensive, but we are seriously considering going for it. It seems to have less of those potential annoyances. It has a bit less electronics features, but as we don't have them now, the lack of those would not be something we would be missing. Waiting now for the salesperson to check if the one model that is immediately available is really available (there is a reservation on it in the system; it is the only such one in Poland)... Similarly, we are in the reservation queue for a CX-30 (it costs nothing the add yourself to the queue). Our hope is that the XV will be available, if not we would have to wait till April... Not clear what we would do if the XV is not there and the CX-30 would be immediately available though... I think I would try to get a higher discount from a higher trim version; several of those are available...

A bit surprised that neither has a nice prepared place to store the fire-extinguisher and the first-aid-kit... They are mandatory, but the have them lying around loose in the car is quite stupid. In my parents' Volvo, it was mounted below the passenger seat (in a bracket screwed to the seat-rails), but the Mazda salesperson recommends not do this: they had a client who mounted it there, but due to a crash the fire-extingisher disconnected and crushed the ankles of the passenger (otherwise the crash would not have been such an issue). In the XV it might fit next to the tire repair kit, but that is not certain.


edit: Interesting article on electric driving. It is in Dutch, but it is something we were expecting to happen in the future, and it is already happening. Electric driving is more expensive than petrol IF you do not have solar panels from which you can charge at home.

https://www.auto55.be/nieuws/33940-de-echte-cijfers-elektrisch-tanken-nu-soms-al-duurder-dan-benzine-of-diesel

It is mainly due to the fact that the electricity price rose more than the fuel price. It still depends a bit on the car, as the differences are close. I also checked it on A Better Routerplanner ( https://abetterrouteplanner.com ) and e.g. the cost of charging an electric car on the trajectory from Poland to Belgium is higher than the fuelcost would be... In addition some electric cars have 30% less range than indicated by the manufacturer (modern petrol-car specifications are said to be closer to reality).

[VJ]

The automatic gearbox of the CX-30 felt fine, but reviewers seem to comment it is a bit old-fashioned compared to many other manufacturers (DCT, DSG, 7-8 gear, ...). Doesn't mean it is bad though.
It is weird: the CX-30 is very nice and everything seems to say it is the smarter buy over the Subaru (cheaper in maintenance, more features, denser dealer network, ...) but I'm somehow still drawn to the Subaru: its large glass sections, thin pillars and amazing around visibility is so refreshing compared to many current cars that almost enclose you in a bunker (I'm exaggerating of course). While the Subaru's interior looks less streamlined, it gives a bigger feeling of space (and has more space for back seat passengers). The front seats in both are very good.

Many reviews really have a problems choosing the "better" of the two as they are quite different despite being similar in size, and it comes down to what you want.

We don't need the off-road (and if we want the better handling of a 4WD, the Mazda's system would suffice for us). More space on the back would be nice though, but the features on the Mazda are also tempting: it feels generally more modern than the Subaru, even though there is not that much difference when you look at the functionality; it is more how everything is packaged and presented... (Features that the Mazda would have that are not on the Subaru are basically 360° camera, head up display, heated steering wheel, electric trunk opening and traffic-jam driving assistance; the Subaru has the better 4WD and suspension but has less need for the 360 camera, its use of 3 displays seems equivalent in functionality to the hud - just less futuristic, ...). So it are rather minor things that would be missing.

Most of the time it is just the two of us in the car, so either is fine space wise for most of the time, but we are expecting to take my wife's parents on occasion... Hence the consideration of rear space (plenty of inlaws-jokes here, next you guys will suggest the MX-5 just for that reason ).

We'll for sure check the Mazda again next weekend (we'll be close to the dealer anyway).

[UtwigMU]

One of my classmates became a startup multi-millionaire. He owns two Mazdas, MX-5 (Miata/Roadster) for when he comes here and CX-5 in his current country of residence. He doesn't own other cars. He has enough money to buy any car.

[paulw]

Noting wrong with the Mazda CX type of auto trans. Some of the best around. We have late model CX5 and Mazda 2. The only CVT that I have owned are Toyotas and they seem fine but where I live CVT has rather a bad name for unreliability .