"Blu-ray Disc" vs. "HD DVD": Neither Is Winning

[ND66]

The end is near. Maybe that will mean an end to this thread too

http://www.theinquirer.net/gb/inquir...-declared-dead

Looks like it is. Too bad.

Paramount in HD DVD blow

By Matthew Garrahan and Mariko Sanchanta in Las Vegas

Published: January 8 2008 | Last updated: January 8 2008

Paramount is poised to drop its support of HD DVD after Warner Brothers’ recent backing of Sony’s Blu-ray technology, in a move that will sound the death knell of HD DVD and bring the home entertainment format war to a definitive end.

Paramount and DreamWorks Animation, which makes the Shrek films, came out in support of HD DVD last summer, joining General Electric’s Universal Studios as the main backers of the Toshiba format.

However, Paramount, which is owned by Viacom, is understood to have a clause in its contract with the HD DVD camp that would allow it to switch sides in the event of Warner Bros backing Blu-ray, according to people familiar with the situation.

Paramount is set to have a bumper 2008 with several likely blockbusters, including the latest instalment in the Indiana Jones franchise.

Paramount joining the Blu-ray camp would leave HD DVD likely to suffer the same fate as Sony’s now obsolete Betamax video technology, which lost out to VHS in a similar format war in the 1980s.

Warners decision last week to throw its weight behind Blu-ray saw it join Walt Disney, 20th Century Fox and Metro-Goldwyn-Mayer as backers of the Sony format.

The Warners move gives Blu-ray about 70 per cent of Hollywood’s output, although the format’s grip on film content will increase further when Paramount comes aboard.

It is unclear whether DreamWorks Animation has the same get-out clause in its contract with the HD DVD camp.

However, Paramount and DreamWorks have a close relationship, with Paramount distributing DreamWorks Animation films. The two companies also signed their HD DVD contracts at the same time. Meanwhile, Universal has declined to comment on its next-generation DVD plans since the Warners move.

Sir Howard Stringer, chief executive of Sony, on Monday held out an olive branch, saying the company would be “open to dialogue” with the HD DVD camp to “grow the market”. The move came as new figures showed that Blu-ray had opened up a decisive lead over the rival home entertainment format.

Sir Howard said: “We are not going to push people around. We’ll talk to anyone ... we have a lot of work to do to grow the market. We’ll be systematic and open to dialogue at all times.”

He added that Sony still had “a lot of work” to do to get Blu-ray “widely accepted” among American consumers.

“With Warner’s support you saw billboards going up in different places and you saw television commercials getting more and more sophisticated and that’s what we’ll continue doing,” said Sir Howard.

The Financial Times Limited 2008

http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/dc409afa-bd75-11dc-b7e6-0000779fd2ac.html?nclick_check=1

[ND66]

After reading this one:

Betamax’s revenge

Published: January 7 2008 | Last updated: January 7 2008

A format war in consumer electronics is like the US presidential primaries: victory requires momentum. That is certainly the case with high definition DVDs. Consumers are indifferent between the Blu-ray standard championed by Sony and Toshiba’s HD-DVD – they are similar in capability if not in design – but they do not want to buy the loser and find it obsolete within a year. It now looks, however, as if this war has been won.

In DVDs, the critical momentum-building contests are not Iowa and New Hampshire, but Paramount, Warner Brothers and 20th Century Fox. Without their support there are no DVDs to play. Warner’s announcement that, henceforth, its high definition releases will be exclusive to Blu-ray means that the Sony format is now backed by a majority of Hollywood’s players.

To the victor will go the spoils. The Blu-ray consortium will earn royalties on every drive and disc sold that uses their technology. Once their dominance is established, they may even be able to put the price of Blu-ray up: format wars are bitterly fought because, in the end, the winner is left with a monopoly. For Sony, loser of the most famous format war of all with its Betamax video tape, that victory will be especially sweet.

Even a Blu-ray triumph, however, will leave the industry worse off than if there had been no such battle at all. First, the costs of Blu-ray’s fight for market share will probably be recouped through higher fees, while HD-DVD’s backers have lost a fortune. Second, and more important, consumer acceptance and uptake of high capacity DVDs has suffered a setback.

That matters because the new discs are a marginal technology anyway. Basic DVD only became a mass market technology relatively recently and consumers may not be willing to pay again for a sharper picture and more storage space. If the industry is to promote new standards it must be united.

Barring surprises, or a few billion dollars in sweeteners for the Hollywood studios, HD-DVD has lost and Blu-ray has won. But rather than another video cassette or DVD, the industry may have found another MiniDisc. That format was a detour on music’s route from cassette to compact disc. Blu-ray, too, may be but a footnote to video’s move to downloads from today’s DVDs.

I’m just waiting for Jerry to chime in with his famous “Death as Disco” craze.....or not?!

Maybe Jerry is right?!


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[Claymonkey]

You know... Blu-ray/HD-DVD really does feel like a MiniDisc redux (also a Sony tech). Honestly, you actually sit on the other end of a room a screen sized properly for that space will make the difference between DVD/HD hard to see. Mind you if DVD was at 480 instead of 720 I might argue that but it isn't.

I'm not saying ignore more detail or 720 FTW forever but I personally don't see why I'd replace any of my DVD's with Blu-Ray/HD-DVD. Special features on the DVD's get watched MAYBE once and then never again so MORE features is a mixed blessing.

[Tjalfe]

Sure he is right, it will just take a loooong time before everyone has teh bandwitdth to make this possible. till such time, disk media will win.

[ND66]

I'm sure Sony had good notes from last time on format war and why they lost.


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[Claymonkey]

I'm sure Sony had good notes from last time on format war and why they lost.


.

Which last time?

[ND66]

Which last time?

That time:

The VHS format's defeat of the Betamax format became a classic marketing case study. Sony's attempt to dictate an industry standard backfired when JVC made the tactical decision to forgo Sony's offer of Betamax in favor of developing their own technology. They felt that it would end up like the U-Matic deal, with Sony dominating.

By 1980, JVC's VHS format controlled 70% of the North American market. The large economy of scale allowed VHS units to be introduced to the European market at a far lower cost than the more-rare Betamax units. In the UK, Betamax held a 25% market share in 1981, but by 1986 it was down to 7.5% and continued to decline further. By 1984, forty companies utilized the VHS format in comparison with Beta's twelve. Sony finally conceded defeat in 1988 when it too began producing VHS recorders.

In Japan, Betamax had more success and eventually evolved into Enhanced Definition Betamax with 500+ lines resolution (DVD quality), but eventually both Betamax and VHS were supplanted by laser-based technology. The last Sony Betamax was produced in 2002.

For more information on why Betamax lost to VHS, see The Videotape Format War.

[Nappe1]

the real sneaker was Philips. it has only once made mistake supporting one format and no one remembers that. (Video 2000, anyone?? They did realize early enough to kill it and go with VHS.) In these two cases, Philips was in both cases at the winning side: VHS and BluRay.

but not only being winning on these two, they have been part of inventing following systems:
- C-Casette
- CD (with Sony)
- DAT (with some IT company, can't recal who it was...)
and BluRay (with Sony and TDK)


while HD DVD and DVD is / was patentized by one single company (Toshiba that is, eventhough there was this DVD Forum collecting license feeds, mostly going to Toshiba and some movie companies.) BluRay patents are held by 17 different companies part in BluRay Association, why ppl still think BluRay being Sony format?

- if sony starts making annoying things to consumers, consumers will buy others' BluRay players. There is at least 6 different manufacturers to select. And Sony does not have more voting power than the other big three in association, so they can't just change specs that everyone else has approved already, so I can't see Sony as bad enemy to consumer as some ppl claim.)

[Evildead666]

I still think the next step is flash storgae, back to good old cartridges.

Reusable, very quick transfers, solid as a brick.

Your 'Rental Cartridge' will contain all your details for the rental business, and all the rentals you want (2-3 films per cartridge depending on average consumption).

Once the DVD's, or discs, have been used/scratched, they are binned.
Cartridges could be recycled quite easily.
Teh technology is known and proven.

[Jerry Jones]

As I've suggested in this thread, there is only one scenario that I believe might give either of the high definition DVD formats a new lease on life.

This is a big *IF.*

IF Apple includes either a Blu-ray Disc or HD DVD player in the next version of Apple TV, then that would give that high definition optical disc format some new life.

I see there's speculation in the New York Times that Apple might announce "Blu-ray Disc" playback capability in the next version of Apple TV...

http://bits.blogs.nytimes.com/2008/01/04/an-apple-tv-with-a-blu-ray-player/

Jerry Jones

http://www.jonesgroup.net

[Jerry Jones]

High definition audio and -- now in 2008 -- high definition ***movies*** via download or disk from VideoGiants:

http://www.musicgiants.com/VG_store.html

More HD downloads!

They just keep coming!



Jerry Jones

http://www.jonesgroup.net

[Hulk]

Jerry in all seriousness I would love to do away with discs and have cheap easily obtainable video downloads but every time I check the links you provide I don't see it. For this last one you buy a hard drive that installs in their server. A preloaded hard drive?

Downloads "coming in 2008."

Thanks for posting the links though.

[Jerry Jones]

From Reuters, more on the http://www.musicgiants.com high definition content game plan:

http://www.reuters.com/article/pressRelease/idUS139445+09-Jan-2008+BW20080109

"We are very happy to be working with MusicGiants in bringing this revolutionary approach to content acquisition and storage to the 32 million HDTV households in the United States," said Pat King, SVP of Seagate Technology. "We think the trends that MusicGiants is experiencing at the high-end will quickly migrate to the mass market once people see how easy it is to acquire premium content delivered on hard drives or downloaded directly into a media server attached to their home entertainment system."

Jerry Jones

http://www.jonesgroup.net

[Hulk]

Can't argue with that.

I mean if the guy promoting the download service says it's great it must be.

Case closed.

[Elie]

Yeah, but I know I'll be going Blu-Ray all the way, not some downloaded content DRM'd to hell with all sorts of copy protection. Besides I don't want to hog my entire bandwidth to download movies, and then do what with them? where do I store the large files? what if I want to take a bunch of movies with me to a friends house to watch? Hmmmm, you see the limitations with downloaded content?

Anyway, downloading movies "legally" may not be for everyone, I still prefer media like DVD and now Blu-Ray.