Russian crises....

[Admiral]

We have 67 dead, 350 people in hospital being treated for gas poisoning, 34 rebels reported killed, including Movsar Barayev and 2 caught.
Some rebels got away, I suppose they'll be hunted down soon.

Don't know if those could be considered acceptable loses but it could've turned out much worse.

[Dr Mordrid]

Yes, 67 dead is a tragedy and we should all offer our condolences to their families & the Russian people. Nevertheless; ~10% fatal casualties among the hostages under those circumstances is nothing short of amazing

I for one think the Russian special forces deserve big-time congratulations for getting 90% of the hostages out in one piece.

I couldn't care less about the Chechens & their "leader".

After getting all the info they can out of the 2 surviving terrorists they should be given one of those patented Russian .40 caliber dirt naps

Dr. Mordrid

[Admiral]

It is amazing, I was expecting the security forces to go in and the rebels to blast everything to pieces, the sleeping gas was a surprise.

[omegaRED]

My thoughts exactly. Its a tragedy, my condolences go to all families in Russia and around the world who lost someone dear today ....

I agree with you Doc, 90% of the hostages rescued is a great success, especially since IMHO the Chechens had no intention of giving up ...

I think the are 2 possible outcomes for the war in Chechnya, first the Federal Forces pull back and Chechnya then becomes what Afghanistan was a year ago, or Putin nukes them ...

[KRSESQ]

Chechnya is definitely going to suffer for this.

Kevin

[Dr Mordrid]

Not to mention Al Qaeda because there were arabs in the group with the Chechens....and the Russians suspect they are Saudi and Yemeni;

Next in their sights....

Sounds awfully familiar

Dr. Mordrid

[thop]

118 dead and over 500 in hospital because of gas poisining from the yet unknown gas they used.

[thop]

seems that all but one person died from the gas.

[Pelle]

Kinda reminds me of "Die Hard":

Agent Johnson: Figure we take out the terrorists. Lose twenty, twenty-five percent of the hostages.
Special Agent Johnson: I can live with that.

P.

[Joel]

It's amazing how little they are being critized in the press. Now if this had of happened in the US....

Joel

[Indiana]

Or even in germany
They would have been totally torn apart by the press and some certain politicians (and seen themselves being sued) if only one single captive had been hurt by their doings even if that had saved the life of all the others

There is no such thing as negotiations with terrorists.

[RichL]

The chemical warfare experts interviewed on TV over here reckon the gas was probably something very similar to an American developed agent called 'BZ'. The gas is some form of hallucinogen that makes its victims extremely disorientated and unable to follow simple instructions.

As far as anyone knows its never been used except in tests and propaganda films. IE against young healthy soldiers in controlled conditions with antidotes and treatments standing by for when the cameras stopped rolling.

Looks like a spectacular own goal for the Russians. That said, they did get 600 of the hostages out alive.

[Dr Mordrid]

BZ can be problematic in anyone that would have a problem with valium, halcion, xanax or any number of the other benzodiazepines. They are closely related and act by binding to the GABA (g-aminobutyric acid, a neurotransmitter) receptors. When GABA activates its receptors they reduce nerve activity in the brain.

Benzodiazepines do this by binding tightly to a specific part of the GABA receptor distinct from the "normal" GABA binding site. Once bound they enhance the effect of GABA so that together they shut down brain activity more effectively. In short: they make you high as a kite and can do it very quickly.

Aside from BZ's the problem with gasses or aerosols being used in crowd control is that it's almost impossible to control the inhaled dose. Those closer to the point of deployment run the risk of getting more than the "theraputic" dose.

In addition some may run a higher risk of adverse affects because of pre-existing respiratory disease (asthma, emphysema etc.), old age, depressed liver function or alcohol consumption. Some of these could arise from the BZ itself or from other chemicals used as a transport media.

In this case the Russians had no good options....they could only choose the lesser of all available evils.

Dr. Mordrid

[thop]

the gas they used was HALOTHAN in a high concentration + another yet unidentified gas.

[RichL]

I heard on the news this morning that it was an opiate. I cant remember the name but I dont think it was Halothan. I think it began with a P.

BBC news is also posting in big letters a snippet from an unnamed Spetsnaz officer who said they shot sleeping terrorists at point blank range.
Of course, when its hostage situation with some of the terrorists supposedly rigged as human bombs, thats exactly the sort of thing the special forces would do.